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Post by charmcityexplorer on Mar 31, 2021 21:07:53 GMT -5
Let's talk turkey here...do we go back to the Christian Brother route, or do we stay with a layperson? Layperson. You need to make the right hire. That is the bottom line. Why would a Christian Brother unequivocally not be the right hire to lead a La Sallian university? There are still plenty of Jesuit presidents at Jesuit colleges and universities, for example. I’m not saying that our next President must be a Brother. I’m just curious as to why you’re opposed to the idea. |
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Mar 31, 2021 21:22:56 GMT -5
As long as he comes from a different school, I don’t care. No internal hires.
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LaSallePal
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Post by LaSallePal on Mar 31, 2021 21:23:35 GMT -5
Curious if Xavier’s new president qualifies as having “extensive work” at American universities and, if not, at which year of experience that designation is attained. Murica or bust Being hired at Xavier, she has a non-zero number of years in the American higher education landscape. When she was hired at La Salle, that number was zero. Have you ever considered being less contrarian? Because pretty much every outlier on that list has more years in American higher ed than the current student body has been alive. Can we consider 1/4th of an expected lifetime extensive? Can we appreciate that useful knowledge is often regional? Can we appreciate that Florida doesn't need snow plows, palm trees don't do well in Pennsylvania and that the skill set of Harvard University's president probably wouldn't translate well to Oxford University and vice versa? Can we appreciate that Xavier is a much better place for someone to learn on the job than a small university in a saturated market with a junk bond rating and an enrollment whose shrinkage is outpacing its peers?
This is a Donald Trump-tier snarky non-reply that does nothing but make me think less of you as a person. You're better than this. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2021 21:25:38 GMT -5
As long as he comes from a different school, I don’t care. No internal hires. Why’s it have to be a he? Why are you so sexist and transphobic? |
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Mar 31, 2021 21:27:03 GMT -5
You’re the one that’s saying a non-American can’t lead an American college. It’s an absurd way of thinking. I had my doubts about Colleen RE: sports and basketball coming in and think she did fine in that regard. Again, anything substantial needs board approval anyway.
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Mar 31, 2021 21:27:33 GMT -5
As long as he comes from a different school, I don’t care. No internal hires. Why’s it have to be a he? Why are you so sexist and transphobic? we were talking about Christian Brothers. Real top notch reply here. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2021 21:34:10 GMT -5
Why’s it have to be a he? Why are you so sexist and transphobic? we were talking about Christian Brothers. Real top notch reply here. No. There was talk of layperson or Christian brother. There was no talk inherently referring to a brother. You’re too bigoted to even see how transphobic you are. And stop assuming a Christian brother identifies as a he. Ask their pronouns first. |
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LaSallePal
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Post by LaSallePal on Mar 31, 2021 21:54:43 GMT -5
You’re the one that’s saying a non-American can’t lead an American college. It’s an absurd way of thinking. I had my doubts about Colleen RE: sports and basketball coming in and think she did fine in that regard. Again, anything substantial needs board approval anyway. I question your reading comprehension. I included several examples of non-Americans leading American colleges that took the time to learn and understand the system. This is ironically a deeply American way of thinking on your part: "Everywhere is basically America." Canadian universities have boards too, you know, and my "absurd way of thinking" is shared to some degree by every Ivy League university and pretty much every university with a notable amount of research activity or an endowment that could blot out the sun.
You're summarizing what I'm saying dishonestly. I'm fine with bringing in a non-American president if there is an obvious upside that outweighs the downside. Did an unexpected number of La Salle graduates land jobs at Bombardier, RBC, Magna, or any other Canadian headquartered company, or the American branch thereof? Did La Salle gain anything by going to the trouble of adding the visa process, expense and hassle on top of the search? Was there anything Hancyz did that was unique to La Salle? Or did she do her best Bain Capital impression?
Of all the things I mentioned, you have so far responded to... sports, the least important element of that equation.
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Post by thelasallelunatic on Mar 31, 2021 22:15:46 GMT -5
we were talking about Christian Brothers. Real top notch reply here. No. There was talk of layperson or Christian brother. There was no talk inherently referring to a brother. You’re too bigoted to even see how transphobic you are. And stop assuming a Christian brother identifies as a he. Ask their pronouns first. His reply was in response to charmcity's Christian Brother question. I would like to see the school get back to it's roots, if we can get a Brother that can raise money. |
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Mar 31, 2021 22:30:38 GMT -5
we were talking about Christian Brothers. Real top notch reply here. No. There was talk of layperson or Christian brother. There was no talk inherently referring to a brother. You’re too bigoted to even see how transphobic you are. And stop assuming a Christian brother identifies as a he. Ask their pronouns first. Ha ha it is very funny to take real issues and then diminish them to score cheap jokes for like minded people ha ha very good who cares who this might affect in real life! |
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Post by theneumann64 on Apr 1, 2021 5:31:42 GMT -5
You’re the one that’s saying a non-American can’t lead an American college. Again, anything substantial needs board approval anyway. This board? |
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Apr 1, 2021 5:55:42 GMT -5
You’re the one that’s saying a non-American can’t lead an American college. Again, anything substantial needs board approval anyway. This board? One can dream. Vote coachd as Chairman |
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Post by explorer88 on Apr 1, 2021 8:13:10 GMT -5
Layperson. You need to make the right hire. That is the bottom line. Why would a Christian Brother unequivocally not be the right hire to lead a La Sallian university? There are still plenty of Jesuit presidents at Jesuit colleges and universities, for example. I’m not saying that our next President must be a Brother. I’m just curious as to why you’re opposed to the idea. Not opposed. Just don't think we will find one. La Salle has been led by Christina Brothers for a long time and quite frankly they have not led La Salle to where the competition has gone. Just look at La Salle 60-70 years ago until when Brother Mike left and look at La Salle's competition back then and now and you can easily see which schools advanced further than La Salle has. I am not the the biggest fan of the outgoing President but not her biggest critic either. The bottom line is La Salle needs to think differently to become better and for it's own survival. I am not confident we can find that in a Christian Brother. If we do then great as I think it is the best of both worlds but short of that we are more likely to find a layperson who can make La Salle stronger and still use LaSallian values to promote and beat the heartbeat of the school. |
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Post by diehardexplorer on Apr 1, 2021 8:53:44 GMT -5
Why would a Christian Brother unequivocally not be the right hire to lead a La Sallian university? There are still plenty of Jesuit presidents at Jesuit colleges and universities, for example. I’m not saying that our next President must be a Brother. I’m just curious as to why you’re opposed to the idea. Not opposed. Just don't think we will find one. La Salle has been led by Christina Brothers for a long time and quite frankly they have not led La Salle to where the competition has gone. Just look at La Salle 60-70 years ago until when Brother Mike left and look at La Salle's competition back then and now and you can easily see which schools advanced further than La Salle has. I am not the the biggest fan of the outgoing President but not her biggest critic either. The bottom line is La Salle needs to think differently to become better and for it's own survival. I am not confident we can find that in a Christian Brother. If we do then great as I think it is the best of both worlds but short of that we are more likely to find a layperson who can make La Salle stronger and still use LaSallian values to promote and beat the heartbeat of the school. not opposed to a christian brother being the next president but let's be realistic here. the last two christian brothers who were presidents here had little to no business or fund raising expertise. brother joseph burke's tenure was an unmitigated disaster and brother mike had to fight an uphill battle the entire time he held the job just trying to clean up the mess that burke left behind. burke was the one who pushed for the current gola renovation instead of the 6k capacity version with seats surrounding the court that was proposed by some alums who were willing to do it at cost. that would have cost less than what they paid for the current configuration. you can't make this stuff up. la salle needs to find someone with a strong business and fund raising background. if there's a christian brother out there who meets those requirements, i'm all for it. but something tells me that person will be hard to find so another layperson will most likely be the best way to go. |
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Post by diehardexplorer on Apr 1, 2021 8:56:22 GMT -5
You’re the one that’s saying a non-American can’t lead an American college. It’s an absurd way of thinking. I had my doubts about Colleen RE: sports and basketball coming in and think she did fine in that regard. Again, anything substantial needs board approval anyway. I question your reading comprehension. I included several examples of non-Americans leading American colleges that took the time to learn and understand the system. This is ironically a deeply American way of thinking on your part: "Everywhere is basically America." Canadian universities have boards too, you know, and my "absurd way of thinking" is shared to some degree by every Ivy League university and pretty much every university with a notable amount of research activity or an endowment that could blot out the sun.
You're summarizing what I'm saying dishonestly. I'm fine with bringing in a non-American president if there is an obvious upside that outweighs the downside. Did an unexpected number of La Salle graduates land jobs at Bombardier, RBC, Magna, or any other Canadian headquartered company, or the American branch thereof? Did La Salle gain anything by going to the trouble of adding the visa process, expense and hassle on top of the search? Was there anything Hancyz did that was unique to La Salle? Or did she do her best Bain Capital impression?
Of all the things I mentioned, you have so far responded to... sports, the least important element of that equation.
i find it interesting that there's been no response to this. |
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Apr 1, 2021 12:56:45 GMT -5
Because its non-sensical. The argument is a non-american can't lead without experience but the only way a non-american can get experience is to first get a job without experience.
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Post by diehardexplorer on Apr 1, 2021 13:20:56 GMT -5
Because its non-sensical. The argument is a non-american can't lead without experience but the only way a non-american can get experience is to first get a job without experience. no it's not. a non-american could start out as a professor, dean, provost, etc. and learn about the inner-workings of an american university as they work their way up the ladder. |
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Post by MisterD on Apr 1, 2021 13:24:40 GMT -5
C'mon. Professor at an American university is better experience than leading a Canadian university?
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Post by calsufan on Apr 1, 2021 14:36:43 GMT -5
I question your reading comprehension. I included several examples of non-Americans leading American colleges that took the time to learn and understand the system. This is ironically a deeply American way of thinking on your part: "Everywhere is basically America." Canadian universities have boards too, you know, and my "absurd way of thinking" is shared to some degree by every Ivy League university and pretty much every university with a notable amount of research activity or an endowment that could blot out the sun.
You're summarizing what I'm saying dishonestly. I'm fine with bringing in a non-American president if there is an obvious upside that outweighs the downside. Did an unexpected number of La Salle graduates land jobs at Bombardier, RBC, Magna, or any other Canadian headquartered company, or the American branch thereof? Did La Salle gain anything by going to the trouble of adding the visa process, expense and hassle on top of the search? Was there anything Hancyz did that was unique to La Salle? Or did she do her best Bain Capital impression? Of all the things I mentioned, you have so far responded to... sports, the least important element of that equation.
i find it interesting that there's been no response to this. So following that logic, non-American's shouldn't be the CEO of an American based business as well? And vice versa? If someone has a certain skill set be it running a corporation or running a university, the difference is not going to be that great that they can't overcome nuances and / or areas that they might be a little weaker on. It's also why you have people working for you that can help you in areas that you're weak. |
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Post by diehardexplorer on Apr 1, 2021 14:37:30 GMT -5
#1, it's nonsensical. no dash in there.
#2, never said someone would jump from professor directly to school president. it's called working up the ladder, learning how a u.s. university works, advance to a dean, provost, vp of student affairs, etc, and then maybe the next step would be a university president.
keep on trying though, but maybe you should just accept that lasallepal got it right.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Apr 1, 2021 14:58:16 GMT -5
There is going to be an interim President for at least a year. This is known and openly discussed in meetings I have been in. How much rope that interim leader is given is up for debate.
I want 3 focuses in a new President:
1) Focus on getting resources (donors, sponsors, high level faculty, capital projects, etc)
2) enrollment, enrollment, enrollment - and then retention, retention, retention (student experience is a part of this...happy, challenged students stay)
3) Ensuring the charism and culture of a Lasallian institution permeates through the school
A Brother can definitely do #3, but we need someone who can do all 3...or...get the right people under them who can. Every major strategic decision of the University should relate up to one of these core 3 things.
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LaSallePal
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Post by LaSallePal on Apr 1, 2021 16:12:21 GMT -5
C'mon. Professor at an American university is better experience than leading a Canadian university? Yeah this is what I meant about being less obtuse. You either know that there are other positions at a university and you're just farting into the wind because it's easier than critical thinking and you just want to run up the post count, or you should return your degree and find the nearest adult.
For what it's worth, despite having a law degree Hancyz can't practice law in America. Why? Because she hasn't demonstrated competence and familiarity with the American legal system. If she had a license to practice medicine in Canada, there would be some similar hoop jumping even though Canadian humans are indistinguishable from their flabby American counterparts.
I'm still not finding a lot of discussion other than "lol that's ridiculous you idiot" so... yeah. |
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Apr 1, 2021 16:52:44 GMT -5
I have an inherent disagreement with your premise so I’m not going to engage anymore. If you could highlight data showing that Canadian (or foreign) individuals do worse as American University presidents, I’d love to read it. Just highlighting that most American universities have American presidents isn’t enough for me.
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Apr 1, 2021 17:57:30 GMT -5
#1, it's nonsensical. no dash in there. International spelling. |
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LaSallePal
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Post by LaSallePal on Apr 1, 2021 19:25:01 GMT -5
I have an inherent disagreement with your premise so I’m not going to engage anymore. If you could highlight data showing that Canadian (or foreign) individuals do worse as American University presidents, I’d love to read it. Just highlighting that most American universities have American presidents isn’t enough for me. This is just nonsense. You haven't given me a single university president in America that had no prior experience of any sort in American higher education, and I gave you 36 examples of universities that had boards of trustees which, in practice, agree with what I've said. So whether or not the hundreds of people on those 36 boards would say it outright, in practice they and I are in alignment. These aren't backwater universities, and many of these board members have experience in international business. You're not even engaging with my premise, again, which is that people unfamiliar with the American education system are not the best candidates to run a university in that framework, not that "most American universities have American presidents."
And we don't even have to make this an American thing!
The last president of Mount St. Mary's got run out of town because he had no idea how universities work and he tried to run the university as a CEO would run a business, rather than the sprawling network of unaligned interests it is. He fired two professors, one of whom had tenure, for criticizing him. He likely ran afoul of regional accrediting agency rules. And he asked why Mount St Mary's, a seminary and one of the nation's oldest Catholic institutions of higher learning, had so many crucifixes. He also actually worked at Bain Capital, and his entire background is in finance.
He was replaced by Timothy Trainor, who previously worked as the provost-equivalent at the United States Military Academy.
One last thing: If we have to hire people to paper over the flaws of a president, maybe they're not the best person for the job. Except in very specific circumstances, going in with that as a core assumption is insane and dysfunctional. Those auxiliary positions get real expensive, real quick.
The point of this isn't even to beat up on Hancyz, it's to point out that the board made a mistake in retrospect, and examining some of the ways in which it was a mistake so that it doesn't happen again. Alternatively, embrace the dysfunction and re-invent the wheel by committee every time a big decision comes up.
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Post by MisterD on Apr 1, 2021 19:38:34 GMT -5
So if you think our board made a mistake how dumb must Xavier be for bailing us out to their own detriment?
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Post by calsufan on Apr 1, 2021 19:46:59 GMT -5
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Post by glorydays on Apr 1, 2021 19:56:31 GMT -5
A few years ago, I suggested Ed Rendell be considered as our President when Bros. Mike announced his impending retirement. I have never been asked for an opinion since then.....
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LaSallePal
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Post by LaSallePal on Apr 1, 2021 20:09:56 GMT -5
You'll note a few things here. He's basically the ideal academic-private industry guy. Same deal: Pradeep Khosla at UC San Diego.
A few years ago, I suggested Ed Rendell be considered as our President when Bros. Mike announced his impending retirement. I have never been asked for an opinion since then..... I'd be on board with this hypothetically, or would have been a few years ago... he's 77 now. |
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Post by calsufan on Apr 1, 2021 20:24:24 GMT -5
You'll note a few things here. He's basically the ideal academic-private industry guy. Same deal: Pradeep Khosla at UC San Diego.
A few years ago, I suggested Ed Rendell be considered as our President when Bros. Mike announced his impending retirement. I have never been asked for an opinion since then..... I'd be on board with this hypothetically, or would have been a few years ago... he's 77 now. Yes, but tell me how he became President? He got experience, just like she did. Your basic premise is pure bullshit, because if that was the case, a Canadian couldn't run an American company or, A Brit couldn't, or... A university is a university. Each one is different, but it's not some unique thing to run an American university because you're from another country. You have this cockamamie view, but it's an opinion. And talk about twisting words. Any President surrounds themselves with people that add skills and expertise, because no one is strong in every area. If you don't recognize that I don't know what to say. |
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