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Post by mookie on Jan 23, 2014 16:11:02 GMT -5
I don't think anyone was thinking perennial NCAA team...but certainly this year to piggyback off of last year. We're graduating 4 senior guards (3 who start) - I think we all realistically were ok with taking a step back after this year. No one was unrealistic to think we would be in this year. That's why no top 50 teams would schedule us. I said to my wife as we left the Temple game that we would lose on Wed to the Bonnies. That was as predictable as the sunrise. Vegas knew it, I knew it - a letdown was inevitable. I think we all need to move on from it, as bad as it was, and re-focus on Saturday. I'm sorry, but I'm pretty sure many of us expected the team to take a step back this year because of the loss of Galloway. I also think many expected next year for the team to be better than this year's team. Wichita State had players that were ready to step in. Early has improved and VanFleet has more than tripled his production from his freshman year...Just to name a couple. They also have been healthy (big difference from our team). Another big difference? They were a 30 win team last year! Won 27 the year before and 29 prior. They are a really good team and were positioned to be a top ranked team. Don't be fooled by the conference they're in...
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Post by goexplorers on Jan 23, 2014 16:27:57 GMT -5
What's with the Wichita State comparisons? As you said, they've won 30-27-29 games the last 3 years! Separate, but related, did you know that Wichita State and La Salle were the only two schools to win at VCU last year? They went 17-2 at home. I looked it up today.
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Post by cpico on Jan 23, 2014 16:31:03 GMT -5
I don't think anyone was thinking perennial NCAA team...but certainly this year to piggyback off of last year. We're graduating 4 senior guards (3 who start) - I think we all realistically were ok with taking a step back after this year. No one was unrealistic to think we would be in this year. That's why no top 50 teams would schedule us. I said to my wife as we left the Temple game that we would lose on Wed to the Bonnies. That was as predictable as the sunrise. Vegas knew it, I knew it - a letdown was inevitable. I think we all need to move on from it, as bad as it was, and re-focus on Saturday. I'm sorry, but I'm pretty sure many of us expected the team to take a step back this year because of the loss of Galloway. I also think many expected next year for the team to be better than this year's team. Wichita State had players that were ready to step in. Early has improved and VanFleet has more than tripled his production from his freshman year...Just to name a couple. They also have been healthy (big difference from our team). Another big difference? They were a 30 win team last year! Won 27 the year before and 29 prior. They are a really good team and were positioned to be a top ranked team. Don't be fooled by the conference they're in... We were picked third preseason in the A-10, it would be strange if "many of us" thought we were taking a step back. I know Wichita State is a really, really good team, but they lost key players off their team from last year and are still playing at an unbelievably high level, that's all I'm pointing out. I'm not saying we should be that good or a perennial NCAA Tournament team. But a lot should have been expected from this team this year and a lot was expected by a lot of people of this team this year. And by the way, I'm hoping that we beat VCU on Saturday because I'm a fan, but with the way the team has played this year that would definitely be expecting too much. I'm done in this thread. Agree to disagree.
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Post by mookie on Jan 23, 2014 17:39:14 GMT -5
I'm sorry, but I'm pretty sure many of us expected the team to take a step back this year because of the loss of Galloway. I also think many expected next year for the team to be better than this year's team. Wichita State had players that were ready to step in. Early has improved and VanFleet has more than tripled his production from his freshman year...Just to name a couple. They also have been healthy (big difference from our team). Another big difference? They were a 30 win team last year! Won 27 the year before and 29 prior. They are a really good team and were positioned to be a top ranked team. Don't be fooled by the conference they're in... We were picked third preseason in the A-10, it would be strange if "many of us" thought we were taking a step back. I know Wichita State is a really, really good team, but they lost key players off their team from last year and are still playing at an unbelievably high level, that's all I'm pointing out. I'm not saying we should be that good or a perennial NCAA Tournament team. But a lot should have been expected from this team this year and a lot was expected by a lot of people of this team this year. And by the way, I'm hoping that we beat VCU on Saturday because I'm a fan, but with the way the team has played this year that would definitely be expecting too much. I'm done in this thread. Agree to disagree. Aren't you one of the posters who says preseason picks are meaningless and now you want to use them as significant because it supports your argument? Lasalle was a preseason pick based off what they did at the end of the Year but no real analysis was actually done. Galloway left, who replaces him? Key players left from Wichita State but had people tau top step in. We didn't... That's a huge difference. Throw in an injury to the best player, which you keep minimizing, who's also the point guard and that's a recipe for disaster. You know college basketball is about guard play...if you can't comprehend the significance of the loss of Galloway combined with an injured star point guard then there is nothing more to discuss.
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Post by durenduren on Jan 23, 2014 17:43:04 GMT -5
Gettin' morbid up in this.
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Post by mookie on Jan 23, 2014 18:03:01 GMT -5
What's with the Wichita State comparisons? As you said, they've won 30-27-29 games the last 3 years! Separate, but related, did you know that Wichita State and La Salle were the only two schools to win at VCU last year? They went 17-2 at home. I looked it up today. I don't know... It was mentioned that Wichita State had key players leave and yet they're undefeated while we've lost 6 or 7 games. They're flat out better than us, been better for a few years now, and had multiple players ready to step up. We didn't...Very different situations. But whatever, this team is a failure *rolling my eyes*
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Post by lwc4591 on Jan 23, 2014 18:42:39 GMT -5
OK we finish the regular season at 19-11, go 1-1 in the A10 tourny and go 1-1 in the NIT to finish at 21-13. Not great but how disappointed can anyone be with our third straight post season appearance with 4 post season wins if this scenario plays out. I would not be jumping for joy but I would be very proud of this senior group who have done very very well. Man things have changed because 4 or 5 years back we would have been very happy with this kind of result which states the direction the program is headed.
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Post by theneumann64 on Jan 23, 2014 18:54:57 GMT -5
I think the Sweet 16 run made some people here believe that LaSalle is a perennial NCAA team now despite being a bubble team who won a few games in the tourney based on a hot streak, and as one poster said, "everything going right". Galloway is one person, but he was a glue guy and a boxsheet filler. Losing him would make this team a bubble team at best and a likely NIT team. Throw in the injury that Duren was playing with to start the season and it makes it completely understandable why the team struggled and loss games they shouldn't have (Manhattan & PSU). Northern Iowa I think was just a bad matchup altogether. The meltdown and crapping on this team needs to stop. The run last year was great and is definitely important for future success in recruiting and securing funding for a new arena but let's have perspective. There will be down times and the team will obviously struggle when there's no person to step in and take over what Galloway provided, but by no means are they a bad team. They are an average to above average team that when healthy, will win games they should win and struggle during the process. They will have bad nights but yesterday, they had everything stacked against them. The Bonnies are a decent team...they are at least average and you put two average teams together, the one with home court advantage will usually win. Let it go...the team hopefully has already and are focusing on VCU now. This. This. And this some more. Honestly, WITH Galloway this year we'd be a bubble team. I think it's fair to have had the high end of your hopes be a return to the tournament this year. What's not realistic is to say that's your goal but then have it be your absolute minimum requirement. If you're expecting La Salle to be a perennial tournament team, you're going to be disappointed. You just are. I guess realistically, I'd hoped they were a few games better right now. I'd think you might grade them as slight below expectations at this point. But that 6 game run showed what they can be capable of. They will probably win 18 or 19 games and probably get to the NIT- barring a run in Brooklyn. Yeah I guess that's a bid of a letdown, but really was within the range of reasonable expectations. Final note- if the future of the program is really such a fickle thing that the whole thing can be unwound by a road loss in January to St. Bonaventure, then a few wins probably don't mean much either.
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Post by cpico on Jan 23, 2014 18:55:02 GMT -5
We were picked third preseason in the A-10, it would be strange if "many of us" thought we were taking a step back. I know Wichita State is a really, really good team, but they lost key players off their team from last year and are still playing at an unbelievably high level, that's all I'm pointing out. I'm not saying we should be that good or a perennial NCAA Tournament team. But a lot should have been expected from this team this year and a lot was expected by a lot of people of this team this year. And by the way, I'm hoping that we beat VCU on Saturday because I'm a fan, but with the way the team has played this year that would definitely be expecting too much. I'm done in this thread. Agree to disagree. Aren't you one of the posters who says preseason picks are meaningless and now you want to use them as significant because it supports your argument? Lasalle was a preseason pick based off what they did at the end of the Year but no real analysis was actually done. Galloway left, who replaces him? Key players left from Wichita State but had people tau top step in. We didn't... That's a huge difference. Throw in an injury to the best player, which you keep minimizing, who's also the point guard and that's a recipe for disaster. You know college basketball is about guard play...if you can't comprehend the significance of the loss of Galloway combined with an injured star point guard then there is nothing more to discuss. Agree to disagree. Hopefully we win Saturday.
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Post by cpico on Jan 23, 2014 19:00:04 GMT -5
I think the Sweet 16 run made some people here believe that LaSalle is a perennial NCAA team now despite being a bubble team who won a few games in the tourney based on a hot streak, and as one poster said, "everything going right". Galloway is one person, but he was a glue guy and a boxsheet filler. Losing him would make this team a bubble team at best and a likely NIT team. Throw in the injury that Duren was playing with to start the season and it makes it completely understandable why the team struggled and loss games they shouldn't have (Manhattan & PSU). Northern Iowa I think was just a bad matchup altogether. The meltdown and crapping on this team needs to stop. The run last year was great and is definitely important for future success in recruiting and securing funding for a new arena but let's have perspective. There will be down times and the team will obviously struggle when there's no person to step in and take over what Galloway provided, but by no means are they a bad team. They are an average to above average team that when healthy, will win games they should win and struggle during the process. They will have bad nights but yesterday, they had everything stacked against them. The Bonnies are a decent team...they are at least average and you put two average teams together, the one with home court advantage will usually win. Let it go...the team hopefully has already and are focusing on VCU now. This. This. And this some more. Honestly, WITH Galloway this year we'd be a bubble team. I think it's fair to have had the high end of your hopes be a return to the tournament this year. What's not realistic is to say that's your goal but then have it be your absolute minimum requirement. If you're expecting La Salle to be a perennial tournament team, you're going to be disappointed. You just are. I guess realistically, I'd hoped they were a few games better right now. I'd think you might grade them as slight below expectations at this point. But that 6 game run showed what they can be capable of. They will probably win 18 or 19 games and probably get to the NIT- barring a run in Brooklyn. Yeah I guess that's a bid of a letdown, but really was within the range of reasonable expectations. Final note- if the future of the program is really such a fickle thing that the whole thing can be unwound by a road loss in January to St. Bonaventure, then a few wins probably don't mean much either. Who said they were expecting La Salle to be a perennial NCAA tournament team? I didn't. But I think they should have had a really good shot of making it there this season - and so did a lot of other people.
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Post by durenduren on Jan 23, 2014 19:13:23 GMT -5
Final note- if the future of the program is really such a fickle thing that the whole thing can be unwound by a road loss in January to St. Bonaventure, then a few wins probably don't mean much either. Think this needs to be bumped. Bringing the truth.
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angryal
Utility Bench Player
Posts: 155
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Post by angryal on Jan 23, 2014 19:37:23 GMT -5
goexplorers said: "I don't think anyone was thinking perennial NCAA team...but certainly this year to piggyback off of last year. We're graduating 4 senior guards (3 who start) - I think we all realistically were ok with taking a step back after this year. No one was unrealistic to think we would be in this year. That's why no top 50 teams would schedule us."
I would agree with this.
It's hard to say whether the 5-hour-plus bus ride contributed to La Salle's flatness and 30% field goal shooting or whether St. Bonaventure is as good as they looked. They don't have any significant wins, but they looked pretty quick and athletic to me. Virginia Commonwealth and on the road at George Washington looks kind of intimidating at this point.
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Post by a10champion15 on Jan 23, 2014 19:39:15 GMT -5
You didn't hear the season ended yesterday
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2014 20:05:48 GMT -5
We were picked third preseason in the A-10, it would be strange if "many of us" thought we were taking a step back... I'm done with this thread... I know you've checked out, but I have a little bone to pick with this final word post. We were third best in this current concoction of a conference last season, and claimed a four seed as the since departed Temple leapfrogged us with a late season upset. So a third place finish in this year's watered down A10 would not represent progress, it would at best be considered holding our ground, or get this- maybe even taking a step back. Also, the Sweet16 was a wonderful moment in our history but circumstances for getting that far aligned in a very unique way that most likely cannot be repeated, especially without what Galloway brought to the mix. I was one of those who thought we would be taking a few steps back this year. Those who were more optimistic than myself (funny, usually I'm the rosy colored glasses one) thought that we would just pick up where we left off, or perpetuated the myth that Stukes would pick up where Galloway left off. I am disappointed in the Manhattan result and disappointed that we did not put away Rhode Island more handily. However, the Bonnies result doesn't faze me one bit. And by the way, we are effectively in third place in the A10 today, so how does this one road loss mean we have missed the mark for the entire season?
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Post by ltrain38 on Jan 23, 2014 20:16:30 GMT -5
I'll just try to say what I wanted to after the game last night in a better way. The five game winning streak, even if only one was against a good team, allowed me and probably others to believe that we were making a move to the top of this conference and could play our way into the tournament in the next few weeks. It was always unrealistic, but I believed it because I wanted to believe. I particularly like the group of players we have and would have loved to see four of them go out that way. But more than anything, I wanted it because I've allowed myself to become emotionally invested in this program to a ridiculous extent and find excuses to be overly optimistic about it, then crushed if things don't go according to plan. I just don't see any hope for an at-large bid after last night, not because of the game itself, but because we just can't afford to lose games at all after what happened in November. We're still a good team. A trip to the NIT is still excellent compared to anything I experienced as a fan of this program before last January. But that loss was deflating from an expectations standpoint.
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Post by fvp47 on Jan 23, 2014 20:18:10 GMT -5
My final comment on this thread. There are not very many terms that are perennial NCAA teams and even the Kentucky's do not make it on occassion. I think our expectations were not unfounded as this also come from almost all sports writter sources. On Jan 7 I sent this email to Andy Katz "Would you have thought that LaSalle would fall this badly after last year with returning all but one starter, though he was an important starter. They start conference play at 7-6. The individual shooting % of all the guards is off from last year." His response "Not at all. Big disappointment so far." I know we lost Ramone but the guards who have at times displayed poor shooting % are the same guards who displayed good shooting % two years running. Keep the faith and Go Explorers
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Post by durenduren on Jan 23, 2014 20:26:04 GMT -5
But more than anything, I wanted it because I've allowed myself to become emotionally invested in this program to a ridiculous extent and find excuses to be overly optimistic about it, then crushed if things don't go according to plan. I'd venture this probably stands for just about every soul that comes here. Well said. Two years ago, the NIT was almost unfathomable. It became a fantasy, pretty much impossible for us. And it became our Super Bowl. And then last year happened, and completely skewed what was realistic and unrealistic, because let's be fair - last year we lived in a mid-major's fantasy world.
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Post by lwc4591 on Jan 23, 2014 20:37:37 GMT -5
I thought I was pessimistic but some of you guys are making me feel like the eternal optimist. We will be going to the tourny this year and again next year and possibly the following year which would make 5 straight seasons the only problem is it won't be the Big Dance but in most cases the NIT. For a school the size of La Salle that is pretty damn good and as G said a few years back once we get good we will stay good and I concur. There are no signs that we are going back to being a losing program and I still believe we are looking at a minimum of 5 straight years with 20 or more wins dating back from 2 years ago and who knows how many more after the five years the streak will run. Tell me where I am wrong and if you don't see what I think I see.
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Post by 1stflooredwards on Jan 23, 2014 21:12:33 GMT -5
This is what I love about the internet. For the most part everything you post/write is saved somewhere. For all those who want to bitch and moan and write off the season, check out the posts from almost exactly one year ago - following the lost to Charlotte. Same posters with the same criticisms. Just replace Charlotte with Bonnies. If I had the desire I'm sure I could go back to the prior year and find a similar post and the year before that (remember the famous "jettison post"?) If you are inclined to react this way after every loss, just shut up and wait until the season is over. www.explorertown.proboards.com/thread/250/another-embarrassing-loss
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Post by durenduren on Jan 23, 2014 21:24:21 GMT -5
We will be going to the tourny this year and again next year and possibly the following year... Okay, wow... He said THE tourney. ... which would make 5 straight seasons the only problem is it won't be the Big Dance but in most cases the NIT. Oh.
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Post by ltrain38 on Jan 23, 2014 21:24:43 GMT -5
This is what I love about the internet. For the most part everything you post/write is saved somewhere. For all those who want to bitch and moan and write off the season, check out the posts from almost exactly one year ago - following the lost to Charlotte. Same posters with the same criticisms. Just replace Charlotte with Bonnies. If I had the desire I'm sure I could go back to the prior year and find a similar post and the year before that (remember the famous "jettison post"?) If you are inclined to react this way after every loss, just shut up and wait until the season is over. www.explorertown.proboards.com/thread/250/another-embarrassing-lossI'm not writing off the season. I'm saying we will not get to the NCAA tournament without winning the automatic bid. A few hours removed from the game, I think we can get a little perspective and realize just how much better things are now, even if we're disappointed, than just a few years ago. I'm not sure what you want people to say, though. If we didn't feel invested enough to be angry or disappointed or just somehow wound up after a bad result - which is very different from accusing players of quitting or saying someone is terrible, or anything like that - why watch the games?
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Post by durenduren on Jan 23, 2014 21:32:05 GMT -5
This is what I love about the internet. For the most part everything you post/write is saved somewhere. For all those who want to bitch and moan and write off the season, check out the posts from almost exactly one year ago - following the lost to Charlotte. Same posters with the same criticisms. Just replace Charlotte with Bonnies. If I had the desire I'm sure I could go back to the prior year and find a similar post and the year before that (remember the famous "jettison post"?) If you are inclined to react this way after every loss, just shut up and wait until the season is over. www.explorertown.proboards.com/thread/250/another-embarrassing-lossI'm not writing off the season. I'm saying we will not get to the NCAA tournament without winning the automatic bid. A few hours removed from the game, I think we can get a little perspective and realize just how much better things are now, even if we're disappointed, than just a few years ago. I'm not sure what you want people to say, though. If we didn't feel invested enough to be angry or disappointed or just somehow wound up after a bad result - which is very different from accusing players of quitting or saying someone is terrible, or anything like that - why watch the games? And let's not kid ourselves. That Charlotte loss didn't suck any less because we made the tourney, and we were still the LAST team in the tourney. The LAST team. Bet if you don't lose to CCSU or Charlotte, it would have been a hair less stressful. It's just as deflating to your tourney chances last year as the Bonnies' loss this year. Different circumstances but still shit. There's optimism, there's being realistic, and then there's sweeping it under the rug. We're all on the same side though, no?
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Post by 1stflooredwards on Jan 23, 2014 21:35:12 GMT -5
Last in is still in, isn't it? You guys are making my point for me by saying we will need to win the A10 this year to get in. We did not win the A10 last year, still got in and still made the Sweet 16, didn't we?
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Post by durenduren on Jan 23, 2014 21:57:47 GMT -5
Last in is still in, isn't it? You guys are making my point for me by saying we will need to win the A10 this year to get in. We did not win the A10 last year, still got in and still made the Sweet 16, didn't we? don't try to compare last year's OOS with this year's... One's much worse than the other.
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Post by belfieldhappyhour on Jan 23, 2014 22:25:18 GMT -5
Hey Neumann or JoeF, let's lock this thread and toss it in the trash before we all start killing each other and disseminating every single word. One conference loss, and everyone wants blood. People need to calm down and turn their focus to VCU.
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Post by theneumann64 on Jan 24, 2014 5:26:21 GMT -5
I'm not really in to locking threads unless I have to. The VCU game is tomorrow, that should create a naturalend point for this I'd imagine.
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Jan 24, 2014 8:31:44 GMT -5
Last in is still in, isn't it? You guys are making my point for me by saying we will need to win the A10 this year to get in. We did not win the A10 last year, still got in and still made the Sweet 16, didn't we? don't try to compare last year's OOS with this year's... One's much worse than the other. I don't agree with this entirely, due just to the word "much." Last year at this time, La Salle's RPI was 33. Today, it is 71. Sure, that is a lot of spots, but the 33 was before the Butler and VCU wins, which only propelled La Salle up to 26 and the UMASS loss kicked them into the high 30s. Beat VCU (#38), GW (#23) and UMASS (#4), not losing to Duquesne in the middle....and you are talking about a sizable jump for the Explorers before a February 8th meeting with St. Louis. The wins needed are still there and every team in this league is beatable.
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