Where are we on November 19th?

[theneumann64]

OK, so we here are: 2-2. Losses to Manhattan and Penn State, narrow wins over Quinnipiac and Siena.

I try not to deal in whether they've performed up to "expectations" because that's so subjective. Everyone's expectations were different coming in to the year. Excitement coming into to this season was certainly warranted, but I did cringe every time I heard about these sky-high predictions. Last year's team was magical, emotional, and special. They were also one of the last team's in the tournament, and played in a much tougher A-10 than this year is likely to be. I was legitimately surprised by the 25 and 26 win predictions from folks this year. Fact of the matter to me, is even if Galloway was still on the team this year, I think they'd have been in the same situation as last year. Low 20's in wins, right on the bubble.

So again, whether they've performed "up to (your) expectations" is largely irrelevant. What's not is this: They've been bad. Yes, it's only 4 games, and they did find a way to win 2 of those games. It's ridiculous to start thinking about March right now. If they go win the Paradise Jam, win some of their bigger marquee non-con games, and finish high in the A-10, everything should take care of itself.

Except, you've seen nothing so far that indicates that's going to happen. They've been wildly inconsistent, and the things they are bad at, are generally things you don't see in good teams. They are a guard heavy team, that needs to hit 3's to win. You can dismiss a few off shooting nights from guys, like a baseball player going 0-4 on any given night not being an indicator of his quality as a player. But the fact is this, they need to hit 3's to win. Generally they need 2 or more guys to have good shooting nights to beat anyone of quality. "They're getting good looks, they're just not dropping" only works for a little while, then they need to go in.

Along those lines: the inside. La Salle is generally not going to beat people on the glass most nights, but you can't get dominated. Wright and Zack are both players who do some things very well, but the defense inside, and the near guaranteed 2 fouls in the first 12 minutes is becoming a major problem. They then are forced to get passive, and start allowing too many easy baskets. They're Juniors now, the output you get every night is what you can probably expect the rest of their time here. And right now, that's concerning.

Overall, yes, it is a bit too early to feel either way about anything. I was hoping to go in to the Paradise Jam at 3-1, but more importantly, looking better than this. Does anyone really see this team winning 3 games in a row in 4 days in the Bahamas? I know Manhattan is probably the MAAC Champions, and Penn State is a Big 10 team on the road. I'm generally inclined to only "give" them one of those. But even could see both, if they looked better in their wins.

Right now, I feel like I'm watching say the 2008-2009 team. Pretty good, will beat most of who they're supposed to, won't beat anyone they shouldn't. I'm not writing this stamping my feet and you'll notice a clear lack of exclamation points. Nothing is "over" right now, there's still like 85% of the season left. But there's plenty of reason for concern, with the overall quality of play being much more troubling, to me at least, than the 2-2 record.

How do you feel?

[vasalos]

This is life after Ramon Galloway. We will miss him terribly as he was our motivator, leader and finisher. We lost our spark and the team will need time to find a new one. I think this team will hit a stride later in the season but right now they are trying to figure out their identity.The team is just flat right now. Ramon's ability to draw a double team created so much last year; that will be missed.

[luhoopsfan]

I'm frustrated because I know they are better than what they've shown. They seem so tentative, hesitant, and like they are forcing things instead of just playing ball

I really feel like they are afraid to foul and have gotten so soft on the perimeter defense as a result, consequently, they aren't forcing TO #s like last year to get out in transition and run. Then teams are going zone on them and for whatever reason, they just can't shoot with any consistency. The formula the last two seasons was win the TO battle and the 3-pt line battle and they've not been successful at all there

I'm more upset for them because I'm sure their expectations and goals are even bigger than ours.

[Kovy]

I was pretty quiet over the summer because I didn't think we would be near as good as last year but I never thought we would look this poor. During the summer I said I just don't see anyone who would replace Galloway and nobody has come close. I was also worried about the high expectations having an effect on the team and I think they definitely have. Right now we look like a team that'll be lucky to finish in the top half of the A-10.

[lwc4591]

Neumann if you were so surprised you should have spoke up. We won 24 games last season and play an easier schedule this season so why wouldn't you expect many posters to pick team to win 24-26 games by seasons end it made sense playing what many thought would be a 33 or 34 game season. We now know it will be a 31 game season.

[cpico]

Where are we? Any chance for meaningful basketball is gone after 4 games - that's where we are.

Really disappointed in the team right now. Again, we just lost to Penn State, that should tell everyone exactly where we're at. Pathetic.

[theneumann64]

Nov 19, 2013 21:31:46 GMT -5 lwc4591 said:

Neumann if you were so surprised you should have spoke up. We won 24 games last season and play an easier schedule this season so why wouldn't you expect many posters to pick team to win 24-26 games by seasons end it made sense playing what many thought would be a 33 or 34 game season. We now know it will be a 31 game season.

Well, here's the first paragraph for my season predictions thread, before I picked them to win 21 games, but the point of this wasn't supposed to be about me being "right" with my more pessimistic opinion. There's enough of that from a few people on this board.


I think they will be good, but I think many on here are underestimating the impact that losing their best player from last year (Galloway) is going to have. The pessimistic way of looking at it would be that they were one of the last teams in to the tournament last year, and lost their best player. Anything that happened after the tournament began last year (the Sweet 16 run) is kind of incidental to this year. They'll have a bit higher of a national profile and some more experience, but that won't help in terms of RPI, Strength of Schedule, etc.

Read more: explorertown.proboards.com/thread/1044/season-predictions-thread-opinion?page=1#ixzz2l9LdWiEM

[theneumann64]

Nov 19, 2013 21:34:07 GMT -5 cpico said:

Where are we? Any chance for meaningful basketball is gone after 4 games - that's where we are.

Really disappointed in the team right now. Again, we just lost to Penn State, that should tell everyone exactly where we're at. Pathetic.

You really believe this? I'm frustrated to, but any chance for meaningful games is gone?

[luhoopsfan]

Nov 19, 2013 21:44:46 GMT -5 theneumann64 said:

Nov 19, 2013 21:34:07 GMT -5 cpico said:

Where are we? Any chance for meaningful basketball is gone after 4 games - that's where we are.

Really disappointed in the team right now. Again, we just lost to Penn State, that should tell everyone exactly where we're at. Pathetic.

You really believe this? I'm frustrated to, but any chance for meaningful games is gone?

Agree completely - it's not over by any means. I've seen temple and SJU look dead in the water much later in the year - there is a ton of opportunity left in the season

I think what you see is that for the first time in 20 years we aren't building towards the promised land - we've been there and are all panicking that it's all over forever

I almost broke my hand on my granite counter tonight and I'm not proud of that at all. But I'm as frustrated as anyone here and trying to keep it in perspective

Win the P Jam, beat Nova, VCU, and everything is gravy. Not saying those are happening, pointing out the opportunity that remains

We will find out how good Coach G is this year

[lwc4591]

Hoopsfan this team can't beat an egg let alone a Div I basketball team. We are 2-2 against teams that are average to bad and are low tier Div I teams.

[cpico]

Nov 19, 2013 21:44:46 GMT -5 theneumann64 said:

Nov 19, 2013 21:34:07 GMT -5 cpico said:

Where are we? Any chance for meaningful basketball is gone after 4 games - that's where we are.

Really disappointed in the team right now. Again, we just lost to Penn State, that should tell everyone exactly where we're at. Pathetic.

You really believe this? I'm frustrated to, but any chance for meaningful games is gone?

Yes, if the goal was to make the NCAA's again. Losing to a decent Manhattan team that we should beat at home was bad enough and left little wiggle room. Losing to Penn State slams the door shut.

[theneumann64]

Well, not to be glib, but we could win 4 more games all year and as long as they're all in Brooklyn, we could make the NCAA tournament. I agree it's not encouraging so far, but it's not like there's no possible scenario by which we improve our lot. Whether you see that happening or not is another issue.

[durenduren]

We all drank the Explorers KoolAid, and now Gola has become our Jonestown.

You'll find me in the neighborhood of angry, sad, and somewhat not surprised this where we are at. Guilty of this myself, but with expectations high, there was a pressure cooker forming.

[luhoopsfan]

Let's not act like they got blown out in either loss, to say they can't beat anyone is ludicrous right now

Things need to change on the floor and the team needs to get its collective shot together. But all hope is not lost. If we were pinning the success of a season on beating Penn State then we never really had a chance from the get go

I think a lot of people are upset it's not going perfectly right out of the gate

[durenduren]

Nov 19, 2013 22:27:23 GMT -5 luhoopsfan said:

Let's not act like they got blown out in either loss, to say they can't beat anyone is ludicrous right now

Agreed but that said, I don't think it matters much at this point. We either need to go on an absolute tear, steal some OOC games, go wild in conference play, or win in Brooklyn - none of which I see happening.

[20thandolney]

(*Language Warning)

[theneumann64]

This is more how I feel right now:

[MisterD]

Everyone who declares we're done and the season is over should just go away. For real. If you believe it, go away, if not, grow up.

[big5explorer]

We lost in double overtime to a likely Tournament team, and lost a game on the road after leading at the half and going cold in the 2nd half.

It's early November. Not January. Relax.

The fact is, this team will need to be a Top 3 A10 team at season end to make the Tourney. Plenty of time to gel and shake off rust. These players have it in them. If you think otherwise, you didn't watch enough games last year.

[durenduren]

Nov 19, 2013 23:09:33 GMT -5 MisterD said:

Everyone who declares we're done and the season is over should just go away. For real. If you believe it, go away, if not, grow up.

I wasn't declaring we're done. More that it's going to be a real uphill battle for this team to get some momentum behind them. I'm not sure this team has shown it has that 'bounce back' character we became accustomed to, but hopefully the Caribbean getaway holds better things for us. There's plenty of games to be played, but they need to figure plenty out obviously.

[MisterD]

I bet a lot of the people dying right now also pegged us finished after losing to St. Louis and Butler. The fact is we're never as good or bad as we look and the current game doesn't predict the next game.

[lasallescreamer]

Its all about the confidence level that the team has. I really thought they would be a very confident group-yet, instead they r very tentative. Shows in the shooting and D.Yet, some pluses. They played hard if not entirely wisely. At times JW and Garland tried to do too much. But JW and Z were fierce on boards and Lewis looked like he is coming on. Thus, not sure what we have. I do know a 8-10 game winning streak would make us all feel good- and its possible, if team plays to its ceiling.

[angryal]

The point is, we're not talking about an 82-game NBA schedule here. With a 30 +/- schedule, after 4 games, teams that are supposed to be as good as La Salle is, should be should be starting to gel, show signs that they have found their rhythm, settle into a regular game approach. La Salle hasn't demonstrated any evidence that anything is about change anytime in the near future with this team.

I think that's what most people are actually looking for at the moment, EVIDENCE that the team is starting to come together. The first four games wouldn't matter so much if they were 0-4, 1-3, 2-2, 3-1, or 4-0 as long we could see something coming together....give fans a REASON to be optimistic.

[stlexplorer]

Reading this thread reminded me of something I read back after last year and it took me a while to find it but here it is. Kinda makes me more depressed at our current state but would love to know if there's a phone call being made from overseas to the team from the guy at the center of these quotes:

"I know they’re going to work hard, I know they’re going to push each other and I know they’re going to get back here." - Ramon Galloway, March 31, 2013

"Before we left out of the locker room, before we all split up, Ramon’s telling everybody ‘don’t hold your heads (down), you’ve got something to look forward to next year.' We made it this far, so now we know what it’s like to get our feet in the NCAA tournament, so next year we should be well-prepared.” - Tyreek Duren, March 31, 2013

cityofbasketballlove.com/2013/03/ramon-galloway-leaves-la-salle-a-changed-program/

[durenduren]

Nov 20, 2013 2:47:07 GMT -5 stlexplorer said:

...but would love to know if there's a phone call being made from overseas to the team from the guy at the center of these quotes

Knowing that he was such a standup guy, I'd be surprised if he didn't reach out or if Giannini hasn't reached out to him.

Real good flashback there though, thanks. Needed it.

[las71]

I was one of the posters that believed we would be able to overcome the loss of Ramon. I'm now pretty sure I was wrong. His athleticism and big shot abilities forced teams to focus on him which helped our other guards get better looks. While many are complaining about the play of our bigs, I think it's our guards who are hurting us. They lack the athleticism to get their own shots and no longer have Ramon to get them the ball in good spots. Tyrone is not a good enough 3 point shooter and while he is quick, teams can play off him and make it more difficult for him to get to the hoop. Sam needs time to get his feet set to shoot well and misses Ramon's dribble and kick outs. Tyreek is a very good A10 point guard but not a go to guy type as he too has difficulty breaking down bigger more athletic guards. He too misses Ramon who truly opened the floor up for everyone. Khalid brings big time athleticism but we need to see if he has the skill set to go with his athleticism and needs at least a few more games to make up for his injury. DJ is a kid we all like but in a top program can't be more than an 8-10 minute a game player. I don't want to write off the season as I expected a big year but now not so sure. The good news for me is that because I expected a good yer I am in St. Thomas for the Paradise Jam. Not sure I would have made the trip if i knew we would be 2-2 going in.

[talkinbball]

I thought after going through last year there would be a real positive carryover effect but, so far, it looks like the expectations were too much for this team to handle. Also, while I think most people recognized it, Galloway was the "it" player who is no longer there to fall back on and he is missed way more than, at least, I thought he would be. I thought that based on the experience and what he showed in the tournament, that JW in particular would raise his game to another level, and that the senior leadership of Duren and Mills would really set the tone for the team. Instead, they seem to be playing without focus, sense of urgency and, worst of all, swagger/confidence. Once that is lost, I don't know how you get it back without putting together some consistent performances. I hope this happens soon.

I should also add that I thought, it looks completely mistakenly, that Garland had the potential to also be an "it" player.

[coqui900]

I didn't see the Siena or Penn State game.

But Manhattan: We lost to a team that would certainly compete in the A-10. In Double OT. After a very big comeback In the first game of the season where there's rust and the like against a very tricky defense.

Quinnipiac: Yes, it would have been nice to blow the team out of the water. But they won. The game was also at 9 AM and very sloppy for both teams. But they won -- is how much they won by really a thing?

Siena: Again, I didn't see it. But they won and nutted up to do so.

Penn State: A competitive road loss against a BCS team. It happens.

The season is far, far, far from over.