vcu game thread

[walkon]

Explain to me why Zan was essentially benched? Difference in the game.

[explorer88]

Just a fucking wasted opportunity today.

Our top scorer doesn’t show up.
Terrible defensive lapses late in the game

Our talent level is not good enough but VCU is very very average.

[hykos1045]

Anyone have La Salle +6.5?
If so, congrats on your cover*.


We coulda had those guys. I would like to see us clean up a few of the mistakes coming out of halftime, as well as in the final moments where Zan was on the bench that we basically gave then unfettered access to the rim. Discouraging finish.

(*Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER.)

[victoriouslasalle]

our guys play hard, a valiant effort but not good enough. game outcome and personnel wise... not quite good enough IMHO.

[victoriouslasalle]

I am thinking Zan and Jocious are each improving their games but Brantley is offensively regressing

[1863]

Another ice-cold second half for our shooting. 🤷

[las71]

Khalil has been struggling lately but nobody covered themselves in glory today. A winnable game but we had difficulty scoring. We once again didn't have much in the way of favorable matchups to exploit. Somebody please tell me that we're in with at least 2 athletic 6'6" wings.

[lasallejohn]

Gotta say the frontcourt had a better game today. Rokas caught a cross court pass and dunked one. Unbelievable!

[diehardexplorer]

Jan 13, 2024 12:50:13 GMT -5 1863 said:

I almost choked on my water when I heard the one an announcer say that La salle was good at protecting the ball. 😆

you might want to rethink that.  la salle is second in the a10 and tied for 26th in d1 in fewest turnovers committed (9.9 per game). 

atlantic10.com/stats.aspx?path=mbball&year=2023#turnovers
www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/team/217

[diehardexplorer]

Jan 13, 2024 14:34:19 GMT -5 explorer88 said:

Just a fucking wasted opportunity today.

Our top scorer doesn’t show up.
Terrible defensive lapses late in the game

Our talent level is not good enough but VCU is very very average.

the whole a10 with maybe the exception of dayton is average.  we lack the overall athleticism of most of the teams, but while la salle can lose to all of them, they can beat all of them too.  if khalil has even a half decent game today, it's a comfortable win.  

[diehardexplorer]

Jan 13, 2024 12:58:17 GMT -5 explorer88 said:

Brantley playing stupid. Some games he just kills us.

he really needs to start letting the game come to him.  i understand dunph shows trust in him and jhamir to make plays but maybe it's time to rein him in a little.

[Shout out to my Cousin Bern]

Had the lead at half today and against Mason only to lose. Kind of frustrating but such is basketball!

[explorer88]

Jan 13, 2024 16:30:00 GMT -5 diehardexplorer said:

Jan 13, 2024 12:58:17 GMT -5 explorer88 said:

Brantley playing stupid. Some games he just kills us.

he really needs to start letting the game come to him.  i understand dunph shows trust in him and jhamir to make plays but maybe it's time to rein him in a little.

This!!!!

If he just let the game come to him today we win.

[festushagan]

Gill's absence hurt us today, he doesn't always finish but he can penetrate, an area where our smaller guards struggle at times.
Team's lack of a shooter really evident today.

[explorer88]

We are better with Anwar Gill on the floor than off the floor so his loss has hurt us every game.

What hurts us most is when our best players don’t play well which happens too often. The best teams get production every night from their best players.

Our best players disappear to often . If we get the killer B’s playing well with another player like Shepherd/Tunde/Marrero/Rokas for each game we can compete with almost anyone in the A-10.

It just doesn’t happen enough. We should have 3 more players in the program that could be the 3rd guy each night to
Contribute but they are sitting on the bench each night right now.

[roaddog77]

Well we blew a winning game against VCU today. We look good in the first half, but went cold in the second half of the game. Missing Gill played a major part in our offense and defense side of the ball. Brantley scoring took a major dip after Gill was injured. Brantley is averaging 9 pts per game without Gill in the lineup. Marrero and Fasasi must pick up their play when Gill is out the lineup. In the three A10 lost, second half shooting was a big problem. Too many jump shots and less driving to the bucket. This was a winnable game, but we handed right back to VCU. Well we have a quick turnaround on MLK day to play against St. Joe’s. Let get this victory Monday baby.

[explorerman]

Jan 13, 2024 16:51:17 GMT -5 explorer88 said:

Jan 13, 2024 16:30:00 GMT -5 diehardexplorer said:

he really needs to start letting the game come to him.  i understand dunph shows trust in him and jhamir to make plays but maybe it's time to rein him in a little.

This!!!!

If he just let the game come to him today we win.

I agree and I believe that might mentioned last season.. but he hasn’t played that way in 3 seasons probably not going to change now..

That really isn’t his style..

Someone mentioned it earlier they were just faster and more athletic.. There was a play early in the second half, when a VCU small forward drove to the basket and just moved Brantley out of the way.. Rokas came over the help, as he should when a defender gets beat, and the guy passed around Rokas and no one provided weak side help for an easy 2…

It seemed like for long stretches we were struggling to get good looks and they were just laying/dunking the ball..

Tough one to watch today.. Very very winnable

[explorerman]

Jan 13, 2024 14:32:46 GMT -5 walkon said:

Explain to me why Zan was essentially benched? Difference in the game.

Ya know I am coming around on him… Maybe we should give him more run at the #4.. Dunphy did that for a couple of minutes and I think that might be the best spot.

Helps protect him defensively but we keep a shooter on the court. He had a couple nice mid-range jumpers in tough situations.

[explorer88]

Zan probably deserves more time. Problem is the opportunity to increase his minutes are spotty. Unless you play him with Rokas and go big you are not going to play him over others who can defend and spread the floor more effectively.

With Rokas giving better minutes he is limited with increasing his minutes. If he was 2 inches taller totally different conversation.

[explorerman]

Jan 13, 2024 22:04:21 GMT -5 explorer88 said:

Zan probably deserves more time. Problem is the opportunity to increase his minutes are spotty. Unless you play him with Rokas and go big you are not going to play him over others who can defend and spread the floor more effectively.

With Rokas giving better minutes he is limited with increasing his minutes. If he was 2 inches taller totally different conversation.

I think you have to do it. Even if it is for a few minutes. I agree a couple more inches and much different. But Zan and Rokas gives us a better chance in rebounding. The only other alternative is Shepherd and gets pushed around under the rim. You saw it yesterday there were 4-5 rebound and put backs against him. Zan is a better shooter too. I mean outside of Brickus there is no else I want shooting a mid-range jumper than Zan. So he actually has the ability to spread the court.

Obviously we don’t want to be in this situation. We have to make with what we have. Zan is probably 6’5/6’6 but he is strong. Compare the other parts of the roster and that is extra couple of pounds and inches could mean 3-4 rebounds per game as a team.

Lower half injuries, especially for someone 6’10, have to be a pain to get rid of. So Rokas is coming around but he can’t defend the low post by himself.. If he defends at all… If a perimeter defender gets beat and he comes to help then someone needs to get down there and help the weak side and we don’t have anyone above 6’2 to do that outside of Zan or Shepherd. Maybe Marrero (6’5) too. But Gill, Brantley and Brickus all 6’2 and below, it is unfair to think they are going win battles under the rim even close to a majority of the time.

I mentioned this before earlier this season when we were piling up wins against lesser competition and thus were not focusing on the structural issues of the team.. Sadly, as you saw yesterday, it is coming to fruition, the lack of efficient perimeter scoring will be the doom of this team. Basketball for at least the last 2 decades has been a guard’s game. They have the ball the most in their hands and by far the most shot attempts. “Going small” has been en vogue for probably a decade now. But for us, you can’t shoot less than 50% (true shooting %, the metric used by most coaches) and expect to win games against average/decent D1 teams. I mentioned TS% with regards to Marrero earlier in the week who in late December was low-mid 60s and now around 57%..

For those not familiar, for a guard, 53-55% is average. TS% is a blended average of everything (2s, 3s and FTs). Speaks to your efficiency and skill of putting the ball in the hoop. Anything below 50% is well below average and above 57% is well above average. North of 60% is excellent. For front court players, the averages are moved up a couple percentage points.

But explorer88 as you and I mentioned.. A third of the roster isn’t being used.. With need for height or for just plain offensive skills this is very worrisome. A very average VCU beat us with a first year coach and a hodge-podge of players..

[23won]

I was encouraged by the play yesterday. Like some here (based on Mason and other games) it looked like we could be badly be beaten in the second half and we did not. Why am I encouraged? Because players are embracing Fran's HoF coaching and it is showing on the floor. Specifically,

1) 3 starters shot 4-27 (14%) and we went into the last minute with a chance to win the game (in fact Jig took a shot to tie the game and it spun around more than 360 degrees of the rim and popped out)

2) VCU had > 4" per player height advantage and superior vertical leap skills, and the rebounding battle was close 38-36

3) VCU's point guard goes down and a 6' 8" player assumes his duties and gets 12 assists; go figure. We actually we winning when Jackson (VCU's PG and most experienced player) was in the game

4) Players contributed scoring-wise when Khalil, Shep and Tunde were laying eggs.

It will be interesting to see how we progress going forward and how we prepare for SJU. It would be nice to have Anwar back for his defense against Joe's.

I wouldn't rein in Khalil too much; maybe just show film where he was driving into three players in the lane without a prayer or a shot or an open dish. If he can minimize that we have more productive offensive possessions and can better build leads.

I'd like to see Zan with Rokas, Andres and the Killer Bs on the floor at the same time. Have not seen Zan and Rokas on the floor together but think the two bigs could alternate space in the post (like a 4 in one out) and the other could move to open shot spots or create ball screens for the Bs and Andres. Zan does a nice job on the baseline where he is left alone and hits midrange jumpers, which is a lost art. Unclogging the lane gives the Bs the chance to drive the lane. In one example, you spread the floor, have Rokas pick for Khalil and then Khalil should have the chance to finish down the lane, pass for three shooting options (to dish to in Jig and Andres (3 ball), midrange baseline (Zan)) and a pick and roll dish option for Rokas if double teamed.

[23won]

I don't think VCU is average. Ton of talent. I can see them winning A10 tourney, as I said in another thread.

[coachd]

Another lost opportunity. Praying we can beat the Hawks tomorrow.

[GlitterBro #2]

Fatigue is going to increasingly become a factor as the season wears on. The physical play takes a toll and we aren't letting as many horses out of the gate as other teams. It looked to me like Brantley was limping a bit at the end of the UMass game and after times yesterday after some contact, and I wonder if that is affecting his shooting and decision-making. Earlier in the season he wasn't playing "hero-ball" and trying to dribble through 3 people in the lane. Yesterday those old tendencies came back, and a couple more passes may have kept the ball from being turned over. I actually think we were a better team than VCU yesterday, but running 7 guys against their 10 that played significant minutes...we were worn out and had breakdowns at the end.

The team will have over a week of no games after the St. Joe's match-up to recuperate before Dayton rolls into town next Tuesday. This rest is desperately needed.

[explorerman]

Jan 14, 2024 12:25:51 GMT -5 GlitterBro #2 said:

Earlier in the season he wasn't playing "hero-ball" and trying to dribble through 3 people in the lane.

Those are the ones that kill me.. in the sports world, it is called “playing slow”.. You are ball watching and not looking ahead to the next decision… It is something that he has struggled in his 3-years here..

The difference could be a couple of seconds but that determines if we get a good attempt or not.. Happened a few times yesterday.. When Tunde or Brickus were open and Brantley needed to swing the ball but he held and took a couple dribbles and then passed it by then the defender recovered. Those are the little differences that make a good PG. The mental speed of the game. Having the ability to let the game come to him and “slow it down” so you can faster mentally…

The cardinal sin of any PG is dribbling into pressure. Whether fatigue or lack of awareness. You just can’t do it. 3 defenders means there are 2 players open and he has head down trying to dribble through it.. Just a very poor decision and, generally always, unnecessary..

[calsufan]

Jan 14, 2024 10:05:28 GMT -5 explorerman said:

Jan 13, 2024 22:04:21 GMT -5 explorer88 said:

Zan probably deserves more time. Problem is the opportunity to increase his minutes are spotty. Unless you play him with Rokas and go big you are not going to play him over others who can defend and spread the floor more effectively.

With Rokas giving better minutes he is limited with increasing his minutes. If he was 2 inches taller totally different conversation.

I think you have to do it. Even if it is for a few minutes. I agree a couple more inches and much different. But Zan and Rokas gives us a better chance in rebounding. The only other alternative is Shepherd and gets pushed around under the rim. You saw it yesterday there were 4-5 rebound and put backs against him. Zan is a better shooter too. I mean outside of Brickus there is no else I want shooting a mid-range jumper than Zan. So he actually has the ability to spread the court.

Obviously we don’t want to be in this situation. We have to make with what we have. Zan is probably 6’5/6’6 but he is strong. Compare the other parts of the roster and that is extra couple of pounds and inches could mean 3-4 rebounds per game as a team.

Lower half injuries, especially for someone 6’10, have to be a pain to get rid of. So Rokas is coming around but he can’t defend the low post by himself.. If he defends at all… If a perimeter defender gets beat and he comes to help then someone needs to get down there and help the weak side and we don’t have anyone above 6’2 to do that outside of Zan or Shepherd. Maybe Marrero (6’5) too. But Gill, Brantley and Brickus all 6’2 and below, it is unfair to think they are going win battles under the rim even close to a majority of the time.

I mentioned this before earlier this season when we were piling up wins against lesser competition and thus were not focusing on the structural issues of the team.. Sadly, as you saw yesterday, it is coming to fruition, the lack of efficient perimeter scoring will be the doom of this team. Basketball for at least the last 2 decades has been a guard’s game. They have the ball the most in their hands and by far the most shot attempts. “Going small” has been en vogue for probably a decade now. But for us, you can’t shoot less than 50% (true shooting %, the metric used by most coaches) and expect to win games against average/decent D1 teams. I mentioned TS% with regards to Marrero earlier in the week who in late December was low-mid 60s and now around 57%..

For those not familiar, for a guard, 53-55% is average. TS% is a blended average of everything (2s, 3s and FTs). Speaks to your efficiency and skill of putting the ball in the hoop. Anything below 50% is well below average and above 57% is well above average. North of 60% is excellent. For front court players, the averages are moved up a couple percentage points.

But explorer88 as you and I mentioned.. A third of the roster isn’t being used.. With need for height or for just plain offensive skills this is very worrisome. A very average VCU beat us with a first year coach and a hodge-podge of players..

A couple things...

I'm not there yet on Zan. The sample size of good is far less than the sample size of bad. Hopefully you're right and he is starting to come around, but it's too early to say.

VCU is not an average team. They were taller, more athletic and more skilled than our players and they've played some good games (along with a clunker or two). I think they'll improve as the season goes on. Their biggest problem is that they have so many new players and a new coach; yet they're still better than average.

I agree that the lack of perimeter shooting will hurt us (many here have been calling for them to recruit some shooting small forwards). However, I think the team's biggest problem that has and will continue to kill them is how many points we consistently give up on the inside. Guards can drive and score on us and bigs routinely maul us inside. Our perimeter shooting comes and goes from game to game, but getting beaten up on the inside is a constant.

[walkon]

Agree with most of the analysis here by the faithful. Only exception being this constant mentioning of Zan giving up a few inches to Rokas… what does that matter, if most of Jocius, if not all of his game is played with his feet on the floor, or his hands down on defense? The fact of the matter is, and I think Jocius is a great kid and has talent, Zan plays more physical and has better hands. Fran has obviously to his credit given Zan more minutes, and he has flourished in this role. You can’t teach toughness, you either have it or you don’t. Jocius also gives up too many And1s…. Foul someone with the purpose of denying them a basket.  Going “big” doesn’t mean anything if you’re tall and play small. Overall, Jocius did have one of his better games yesterday I thought. 

This team definitely misses Anwar, as well. He does so many things that don’t show up on the stat sheet, hustle, tips, and loose balls. Just my two cents.

one last observation, I am truly grateful we have Jahmir. What a pleasure to watch every game, and an even better kid. Where would we be without him? At the game yesterday we were talking about how he must be the most composed player we have had since I started following the Explorers. 

[calsufan]

Jan 14, 2024 15:05:27 GMT -5 walkon said:

...one last observation, I am truly grateful we have Jahmir. What a pleasure to watch every game, and an even better kid. Where would we be without him? At the game yesterday we were talking about how he must be the most composed player we have had since I started following the Explorers. 

Mr. Duren would like to have a word with you.

[explorer88]

The 2 inches with Zan matters because he plays lighter on his feet than Rokas does.

[explorerman]

Jan 14, 2024 13:49:23 GMT -5 calsufan said:

Jan 14, 2024 10:05:28 GMT -5 explorerman said:

I think you have to do it. Even if it is for a few minutes. I agree a couple more inches and much different. But Zan and Rokas gives us a better chance in rebounding. The only other alternative is Shepherd and gets pushed around under the rim. You saw it yesterday there were 4-5 rebound and put backs against him. Zan is a better shooter too. I mean outside of Brickus there is no else I want shooting a mid-range jumper than Zan. So he actually has the ability to spread the court.

Obviously we don’t want to be in this situation. We have to make with what we have. Zan is probably 6’5/6’6 but he is strong. Compare the other parts of the roster and that is extra couple of pounds and inches could mean 3-4 rebounds per game as a team.

Lower half injuries, especially for someone 6’10, have to be a pain to get rid of. So Rokas is coming around but he can’t defend the low post by himself.. If he defends at all… If a perimeter defender gets beat and he comes to help then someone needs to get down there and help the weak side and we don’t have anyone above 6’2 to do that outside of Zan or Shepherd. Maybe Marrero (6’5) too. But Gill, Brantley and Brickus all 6’2 and below, it is unfair to think they are going win battles under the rim even close to a majority of the time.

I mentioned this before earlier this season when we were piling up wins against lesser competition and thus were not focusing on the structural issues of the team.. Sadly, as you saw yesterday, it is coming to fruition, the lack of efficient perimeter scoring will be the doom of this team. Basketball for at least the last 2 decades has been a guard’s game. They have the ball the most in their hands and by far the most shot attempts. “Going small” has been en vogue for probably a decade now. But for us, you can’t shoot less than 50% (true shooting %, the metric used by most coaches) and expect to win games against average/decent D1 teams. I mentioned TS% with regards to Marrero earlier in the week who in late December was low-mid 60s and now around 57%..

For those not familiar, for a guard, 53-55% is average. TS% is a blended average of everything (2s, 3s and FTs). Speaks to your efficiency and skill of putting the ball in the hoop. Anything below 50% is well below average and above 57% is well above average. North of 60% is excellent. For front court players, the averages are moved up a couple percentage points.

But explorer88 as you and I mentioned.. A third of the roster isn’t being used.. With need for height or for just plain offensive skills this is very worrisome. A very average VCU beat us with a first year coach and a hodge-podge of players..

A couple things...

I'm not there yet on Zan. The sample size of good is far less than the sample size of bad. Hopefully you're right and he is starting to come around, but it's too early to say.

VCU is not an average team. They were taller, more athletic and more skilled than our players and they've played some good games (along with a clunker or two). I think they'll improve as the season goes on. Their biggest problem is that they have so many new players and a new coach; yet they're still better than average.

I agree that the lack of perimeter shooting will hurt us (many here have been calling for them to recruit some shooting small forwards). However, I think the team's biggest problem that has and will continue to kill them is how many points we consistently give up on the inside. Guards can drive and score on us and bigs routinely maul us inside. Our perimeter shooting comes and goes from game to game, but getting beaten up on the inside is a constant.

Absolutely.. Inside has to be better but, again, basketball is still a guard’s game. Duren has been brought on the thread and that is a great example. Jerrell Wright standing 6’6 and Rohan Brown 6’7 were out starting bigs for the last qtr of season when we finished as 1 of the last 16 teams in the country in the 2012-2013 season. We were decimated on the Boards during our fantastic run. Our headline backcourt had the ability to overcome and actually excel beating the Big 12 Finalist (in their backyard) and the SEC Tournament Champions.

Rokas has to be better than he has this season, I have said so before, it has been a disappointing season for him. But rebounding is a team concept, weak side help defense is a team concept and we struggled mightly.

Like I said to open the game, VCU ran very vanilla pick and roles which resulted in fairly wide open layups. Zan did what he was supposed to do and close off the driving lane. No help defense even though we did have someone in the area but didn’t react. Points in the paint.

The aforementioned play when Brantley gets beat one on one very early in 2nd half.. Rokas comes over to help.. He did what he was supposed to do and neutralize the penetrator.. The guy dumped the ball off between Brantley and Shepherd. Neither moved. Easy 2 points in the paint.

I was really hoping the defense was going to improve as season progressed. Defense is an attitude. More effort and commitment than anything else. Seems like so many teams put scores up well above their season mean and we don't have the awareness to make the correct decision. I mean weak side help defense is not some earth-shattering concept m.. You learn about it when you are 14-15 and getting into high school years