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Post by explorer88 on Feb 20, 2020 7:18:14 GMT -5
Christian Ray knows how to play the game of basketball. Lacks athleticism but makes up for that with heart, toughness, and smarts. Every team needs that type of player.
He does need to improve his shooting but his game lends itself to being the nuts and bolts guy. Something like Ryan Micksell at Dayton.
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Post by sweat83 on Feb 20, 2020 9:00:53 GMT -5
CR hit a couple of big 3s in the second half. Maybe that will get him going the rest of the season. Hustles every second he is on the floor.
Hakim is borderline reckless when bringing the ball up past mid court in final minutes of games.
Move on to GW. Would be nice to get a winning streak started and end the season on a high note. 5 games left. Win 4.
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Post by 23won on Feb 20, 2020 9:16:24 GMT -5
I hear you 88 and Glitter. Though not entirely clear, my rant was more about frustration with us running offense and settling for corner 3s where we have shot horrifically as a team. The only one who has shown ability to make a corner 3 is Spencer, as I noted.
I do like Ray; he has the hustle, the intangibles and BB IQ you want. Unfortunately, his shot and ability to finish are not at the A10 level. I don't see him getting 29 mpg on any other A10 team. As I said, in time, he will be a good player. I would like to see him develop into a Mikesell type player (on Dayton), but Mikesell is a 5th year senior now and he played 8 mpg and shot 49% and 33% from 3pt and 2 pt land as a frosh, so CR has some wood to chop there on offensive development. I have no issue with CR at 8 mpg this year.
I'd love to be wrong, but I don't see us beating any top-10-A10 team with Ray starting and playing 29 minutes, even if his final stats against Fordham were pretty good. His +/- minutes before Fordham were not good, and we are talking about Fordham.
We do have other players playing less that can score and create a shot who bring us better odds to avoid scoring droughts and win games. I'd rather see the experimenting with lineups end. I'd like to see Ash shortening the bench, and having experienced guys playing with confidence instead of looking over their shoulders. I'd like to see us beat remaining teams we are capable of beating, like Mass, GW, SBU and SJU. I'd like to see us take that momentum and win 2 or 3 games in Brooklyn. I don't believe in trust the process approaches. It didn't work for the Sixers and don't see the point. I am not a big believer in seeing us lose by 25+ points any time this year. I think the remaining true fans deserve better, before that number dwindles further. Your views may vary, so feel free to fire away.
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Post by explorer88 on Feb 20, 2020 9:46:50 GMT -5
23, we need better players. No one on this board can tell me any different. As noted on another thread we need more rounded players as well. I would also say better players than Christian Ray playing 29 minutes. However, he is a guy who can fit in a program and would do well with better players surrounding him. I am fine with him as he is performing now.
The formula for a better program under Ash is pretty clear for me right now:
-J. Clark is healthy - C. Moore needs to be a rim protector -E. Croswell needs to develop better passing skills, extend his game out to about 10ft, and play much better defense -A. Hikim needs to develop a shot and play under control. His athleticism and speed is much needed -Need our freshman class to be better players and develop into solid contributors. Every one has holes in their game that is not due to inexperience. I don't see any of them being any more than contributors to the program down the line other than Hikim. That is okay if everything above pans out. I know others here think more highly of the freshman class than I do. - Ash needs to recruit better players. Sorry but that is the reality of things
Finally, to help Ash recruit better get the F****** facility issue addressed.
A lot of ifs there. And not all will pan out as hoped but for me as I look away from this year this is my road to success for the program.
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Post by a10champion15 on Feb 20, 2020 10:05:40 GMT -5
I hear you 88 and Glitter. Though not entirely clear, my rant was more about frustration with us running offense and settling for corner 3s where we have shot horrifically as a team. The only one who has shown ability to make a corner 3 is Spencer, as I noted. I do like Ray; he has the hustle, the intangibles and BB IQ you want. Unfortunately, his shot and ability to finish are not at the A10 level. I don't see him getting 29 mpg on any other A10 team. As I said, in time, he will be a good player. I would like to see him develop into a Mikesell type player (on Dayton), but Mikesell is a 5th year senior now and he played 8 mpg and shot 49% and 33% from 3pt and 2 pt land as a frosh, so CR has some wood to chop there on offensive development. I have no issue with CR at 8 mpg this year. I'd love to be wrong, but I don't see us beating any top-10-A10 team with Ray starting and playing 29 minutes, even if his final stats against Fordham were pretty good. His +/- minutes before Fordham were not good, and we are talking about Fordham. Christian Ray worst games and best games. Clear indication he is developing. IMO, he will be a really solid glue guy for this team. Conference play, he's shooting 33.3% from the 3 and 41% from the floor.
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Post by a10champion15 on Feb 20, 2020 10:21:18 GMT -5
23, we need better players. No one on this board can tell me any different. As noted on another thread we need more rounded players as well. I would also say better players than Christian Ray playing 29 minutes. However, he is a guy who can fit in a program and would do well with better players surrounding him. I am fine with him as he is performing now. The formula for a better program under Ash is pretty clear for me right now: -J. Clark is healthy - C. Moore needs to be a rim protector -E. Croswell needs to develop better passing skills, extend his game out to about 10ft, and play much better defense - A. Hikim needs to develop a shot and play under control. His athleticism and speed is much needed -Need our freshman class to be better players and develop into solid contributors. Every one has holes in their game that is not due to inexperience. I don't see any of them being any more than contributors to the program down the line other than Hikim. That is okay if everything above pans out. I know others here think more highly of the freshman class than I do. - Ash needs to recruit better players. Sorry but that is the reality of thingsFinally, to help Ash recruit better get the F****** facility issue addressed. A lot of ifs there. And not all will pan out as hoped but for me as I look away from this year this is my road to success for the program. 1. Hikim during conference play is shooting 42.4% from the floor and 44.4% from the 3. He has a turnover issue but again, he's a freshmen. 2. It is WAY TOO EARLY to be even be hinting Ash needs to recruit better players. We definitely need that IT guy but it's too early to tell if that player isn't already on our team.
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Post by 23won on Feb 20, 2020 11:08:05 GMT -5
A10, thanks for the best/worst stats. How did you access how A10 the shooting performance? Link?
88, I hear you on a number of fronts you mention. One difference maker would really help. Seed for instance Ayo on Illinois. Granted we won't get a 5 star like him, but I'd love to add a complete Ramon-type difference maker.
Clark, Moore, Croswell, Beatty, Spencer, then our four frosh, Jared (?) and Gill come to mind as 11 for next year. Am I missing someone?
Do we have two open schollies? If so, I'd like to see a long 6' 7"+ forward and (no dis on Ayinde) another point guard. Would love some maturity and athleticism through Grad Transfer, Transfer Hardship case or even JUCO. Schmidt always seems to find JUCOs that fill lineup holes - wouldn't mind seeing that. Maybe even some close academic cases; our Academic TLC could really help a kid who can play but is overlooked by P5 schools due to academic issues. My $.02.
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Post by heftyexpl on Feb 20, 2020 11:49:29 GMT -5
23, we need better players. No one on this board can tell me any different. As noted on another thread we need more rounded players as well. I would also say better players than Christian Ray playing 29 minutes. However, he is a guy who can fit in a program and would do well with better players surrounding him. I am fine with him as he is performing now. The formula for a better program under Ash is pretty clear for me right now: -J. Clark is healthy - C. Moore needs to be a rim protector -E. Croswell needs to develop better passing skills, extend his game out to about 10ft, and play much better defense - A. Hikim needs to develop a shot and play under control. His athleticism and speed is much needed -Need our freshman class to be better players and develop into solid contributors. Every one has holes in their game that is not due to inexperience. I don't see any of them being any more than contributors to the program down the line other than Hikim. That is okay if everything above pans out. I know others here think more highly of the freshman class than I do. - Ash needs to recruit better players. Sorry but that is the reality of thingsFinally, to help Ash recruit better get the F****** facility issue addressed. A lot of ifs there. And not all will pan out as hoped but for me as I look away from this year this is my road to success for the program. 1. Hikim during conference play is shooting 42.4% from the floor and 44.4% from the 3. He has a turnover issue but again, he's a freshmen. 2. It is WAY TOO EARLY to be even be hinting Ash needs to recruit better players. We definitely need that IT guy but it's too early to tell if that player isn't already on our team. Thank you for looking up the Hikim stats. A lot of people are labeling him as a guy who cant shoot. Misconception. He just doesn't settle. He can knock down a three and mid range jump shot.
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Post by explorer88 on Feb 20, 2020 11:53:24 GMT -5
23, we need better players. No one on this board can tell me any different. As noted on another thread we need more rounded players as well. I would also say better players than Christian Ray playing 29 minutes. However, he is a guy who can fit in a program and would do well with better players surrounding him. I am fine with him as he is performing now. The formula for a better program under Ash is pretty clear for me right now: -J. Clark is healthy - C. Moore needs to be a rim protector -E. Croswell needs to develop better passing skills, extend his game out to about 10ft, and play much better defense - A. Hikim needs to develop a shot and play under control. His athleticism and speed is much needed -Need our freshman class to be better players and develop into solid contributors. Every one has holes in their game that is not due to inexperience. I don't see any of them being any more than contributors to the program down the line other than Hikim. That is okay if everything above pans out. I know others here think more highly of the freshman class than I do. - Ash needs to recruit better players. Sorry but that is the reality of thingsFinally, to help Ash recruit better get the F****** facility issue addressed. A lot of ifs there. And not all will pan out as hoped but for me as I look away from this year this is my road to success for the program. 1. Hikim during conference play is shooting 42.4% from the floor and 44.4% from the 3. He has a turnover issue but again, he's a freshmen. 2. It is WAY TOO EARLY to be even be hinting Ash needs to recruit better players. We definitely need that IT guy but it's too early to tell if that player isn't already on our team. A10 I hear you on Hikim. I think he has improved his shot which looked terrible to begin the year. I really do think he is going to develop as we expect him to. For me, I can tell the other freshmen have a limited ceiling. It is my opinion and we won't know the truth until 3 years from now. I hope I am wrong because if I am the program is in much better shape and will turn it around faster but I just don't see it.
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postup
Mop-Up Time
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Post by postup on Feb 20, 2020 12:49:23 GMT -5
Do we have two open schollies? Schools not in the Power 5 can cut players loose at anytime in order to free up scholarships. If the Atlantic 10 didn't vote to uphold the scholarship rules of the Power 5, it's something La Salle should seriously consider.
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Post by calsufan on Feb 20, 2020 13:11:21 GMT -5
Do we have two open schollies? Schools not in the Power 5 can cut players loose at anytime in order to free up scholarships. If the Atlantic 10 didn't vote to uphold the scholarship rules of the Power 5, it's something La Salle should seriously consider. Yeah, what a great message that would send. Brilliant!
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Post by manayunk53 on Feb 20, 2020 13:39:22 GMT -5
We definitely need that IT guy Please don't tell me the computer system is down. That's the last thing this team needs right now.
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Post by a10champion15 on Feb 20, 2020 15:06:21 GMT -5
We definitely need that IT guy Please don't tell me the computer system is down. That's the last thing this team needs right now. Touche'
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Post by a10champion15 on Feb 20, 2020 15:20:35 GMT -5
A10, thanks for the best/worst stats. How did you access how A10 the shooting performance? Link?88, I hear you on a number of fronts you mention. One difference maker would really help. Seed for instance Ayo on Illinois. Granted we won't get a 5 star like him, but I'd love to add a complete Ramon-type difference maker. Clark, Moore, Croswell, Beatty, Spencer, then our four frosh, Jared (?) and Gill come to mind as 11 for next year. Am I missing someone? Do we have two open schollies? If so, I'd like to see a long 6' 7"+ forward and (no dis on Ayinde) another point guard. Would love some maturity and athleticism through Grad Transfer, Transfer Hardship case or even JUCO. Schmidt always seems to find JUCOs that fill lineup holes - wouldn't mind seeing that. Maybe even some close academic cases; our Academic TLC could really help a kid who can play but is overlooked by P5 schools due to academic issues. My $.02. www.barttorvik.com/trank.php#It's a really solid free site for advanced analytics, especially when you figure out how to use it. We do have 2 scholarships currently open. My assumption is they are trying to use one to land Nick Jourdain. They are pushing hard for him from what I read and probably leaving the other one to a transfer, maybe grad. Also, don't forget Clifton Moore was a 4 star, top 130ish recruit, higher than Beatty and Spencer. Obviously, it'd be nice to land that type of guy out of HS but he's a highly skilled player and fills a need for us up front. He could be a huge difference maker.
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Post by golasalle on Feb 20, 2020 16:18:06 GMT -5
Christian Ray knows how to play the game of basketball. Lacks athleticism but makes up for that with heart, toughness, and smarts. Every team needs that type of player. He does need to improve his shooting but his game lends itself to being the nuts and bolts guy. Something like Ryan Micksell at Dayton. Disagree that Ray "lacks athleticism." He is big and pretty good handle, can jump and has very good hands. Will never be the fastest guy on the floor but makes up for it by knowing where to be. Needs to work on his footwork and finishing around the basket but I like his shooting form and I think he will turn out to be a very good shooter over time. According to Ash his work ethic is off the charts. Glad to see him getting this much time as a freshman.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2020 16:33:02 GMT -5
Christian Ray knows how to play the game of basketball. Lacks athleticism but makes up for that with heart, toughness, and smarts. Every team needs that type of player. He does need to improve his shooting but his game lends itself to being the nuts and bolts guy. Something like Ryan Micksell at Dayton. 100% agree. The Mikesell comparison is great. He's a little shorter but I think will be stronger by the end of his career. Similar to a Rohan Brown.
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Post by calsufan on Feb 20, 2020 16:50:22 GMT -5
Christian Ray knows how to play the game of basketball. Lacks athleticism but makes up for that with heart, toughness, and smarts. Every team needs that type of player. He does need to improve his shooting but his game lends itself to being the nuts and bolts guy. Something like Ryan Micksell at Dayton. 100% agree. The Mikesell comparison is great. He's a little shorter but I think will be stronger by the end of his career. Similar to a Rohan Brown. Reminds me more of John Pinone, an early 80's Nova player. I despise Nova with a passion, but I had to admire Pinone's game and work ethic. He was a real lunch pail type player. He wasn't fast and he wasn't pretty, but he was gritty and played hard. I believe that's what Christian Ray will end up being for La Salle.
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Post by victoriouslasalle on Feb 20, 2020 16:53:15 GMT -5
TGIF! Thank God its Fordham. If we play the way we did last night against any other A10 team at this point seems to me we definitely lose. We play hard with a lot of heart and desire (a pleasure to watch). But that aside, we are a really inept basketball team, so many mistakes (dumb passes, poor free throw, bad shots etc.). We were not playing Dayton last night but made the kind of mistakes you might expect facing them. It's disheartening.
Per O execution such a stark contrast after watching the Richmonds and St Louys of the conference.
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Post by explorer88 on Feb 20, 2020 16:57:09 GMT -5
100% agree. The Mikesell comparison is great. He's a little shorter but I think will be stronger by the end of his career. Similar to a Rohan Brown. Reminds me more of John Pinone, an early 80's Nova player. I despise Nova with a passion, but I had to admire Pinone's game and work ethic. He was a real lunch pail type player. He wasn't fast and he wasn't pretty, but he was gritty and played hard. I believe that's what Christian Ray will end up being for La Salle. John Pinone is a a blast from the past. Pinone was bigger at 6"8 and an inside guy but did get by with smarts and fundamentals. Although his game is different than Ray's both would have to succeed with the same traits.
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Post by calsufan on Feb 20, 2020 17:24:49 GMT -5
Reminds me more of John Pinone, an early 80's Nova player. I despise Nova with a passion, but I had to admire Pinone's game and work ethic. He was a real lunch pail type player. He wasn't fast and he wasn't pretty, but he was gritty and played hard. I believe that's what Christian Ray will end up being for La Salle. John Pinone is a a blast from the past. Pinone was bigger at 6"8 and an inside guy but did get by with smarts and fundamentals. Although his game is different than Ray's both would have to succeed with the same traits. I agree Pinone was more of an inside guy, but he eventually developed a short jumper IIRC. Ray although shorter will probably end up doing some work down low. He already rebounds well for his size.
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Post by 23won on Feb 20, 2020 17:37:05 GMT -5
100% agree. The Mikesell comparison is great. He's a little shorter but I think will be stronger by the end of his career. Similar to a Rohan Brown. Reminds me more of John Pinone, an early 80's Nova player. I despise Nova with a passion, bu t I had to admire Pinone's game and work ethic. He was a real lunch pail type player. He wasn't fast and he wasn't pretty, but he was gritty and played hard. I believe that's what Christian Ray will end up being for La Salle. The closest guy in recent memory that compares to Pinone is Cameron Krutwig from Loyola Chicago. I don't see CR as a Pinone type, to be honest. If he plays like, and puts up stats like, Pinone's Soph to Senior years at Nova, I will gladly tap a calsufan memorial keg in the vicinity of Gola in three years, because our team will be damn good as a result of that development plan.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Feb 20, 2020 21:08:30 GMT -5
Who would have thought John Pinone would be trending on Explorer Town?
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postup
Mop-Up Time
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Post by postup on Feb 20, 2020 23:17:12 GMT -5
Yeah, what a great message that would send. Brilliant! Yeah, so it would be better to let the kid rot on the bench for another 3 years, right? That's absolute genius!
It would be better for the player to actually have an opportunity to play at another school, perhaps at a lower level, where he'll get a chance to possibly start.
People on this board write with regularity whenever a player leaves because he thinks he can better his situation, "Oh well....it's a business." Well, it's a business from the college's vantage point, also, and they're serving the best interests of the kid to boot.
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Post by calsufan on Feb 21, 2020 0:28:30 GMT -5
Yeah, what a great message that would send. Brilliant! Yeah, so it would be better to let the kid rot on the bench for another 3 years, right? That's absolute genius!
It would be better for the player to actually have an opportunity to play at another school, perhaps at a lower level, where he'll get a chance to possibly start. People on this board write with regularity whenever a player leaves because he thinks he can better his situation, "Oh well....it's a business." Well, it's a business from the college's vantage point, also, and they're serving the best interests of the kid to boot.
If the student-athlete wants to leave, then let him make the decision to leave. He made a commitment to the school, maybe he's tried his best. Maybe he likes it there even though he's not the star. Maybe he's a positive influence on the team even though he's not the star, but what, we cut him loose because he's not averaging 11 pts. / game? Or is it 11.5 pts./game? What's the threshold? Do we tell the player the number of points he must average / game each year before we give him a scholarship so he knows how high the bar is set? Tell me again about your "genius" plan please.
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Post by theneumann64 on Feb 21, 2020 8:57:01 GMT -5
Yeah, what a great message that would send. Brilliant! Yeah, so it would be better to let the kid rot on the bench for another 3 years, right? That's absolute genius!
It would be better for the player to actually have an opportunity to play at another school, perhaps at a lower level, where he'll get a chance to possibly start. People on this board write with regularity whenever a player leaves because he thinks he can better his situation, "Oh well....it's a business." Well, it's a business from the college's vantage point, also, and they're serving the best interests of the kid to boot.
See if you can come up with one major difference between this situation and every other "business" situation.
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Post by vital on Feb 21, 2020 14:23:16 GMT -5
I hear you 88 and Glitter. Though not entirely clear, my rant was more about frustration with us running offense and settling for corner 3s where we have shot horrifically as a team. The only one who has shown ability to make a corner 3 is Spencer, as I noted. I do like Ray; he has the hustle, the intangibles and BB IQ you want. Unfortunately, his shot and ability to finish are not at the A10 level. I don't see him getting 29 mpg on any other A10 team. As I said, in time, he will be a good player. I would like to see him develop into a Mikesell type player (on Dayton), but Mikesell is a 5th year senior now and he played 8 mpg and shot 49% and 33% from 3pt and 2 pt land as a frosh, so CR has some wood to chop there on offensive development. I have no issue with CR at 8 mpg this year. I'd love to be wrong, but I don't see us beating any top-10-A10 team with Ray starting and playing 29 minutes, even if his final stats against Fordham were pretty good. His +/- minutes before Fordham were not good, and we are talking about Fordham. We do have other players playing less that can score and create a shot who bring us better odds to avoid scoring droughts and win games. I'd rather see the experimenting with lineups end. I'd like to see Ash shortening the bench, and having experienced guys playing with confidence instead of looking over their shoulders. I'd like to see us beat remaining teams we are capable of beating, like Mass, GW, SBU and SJU. I'd like to see us take that momentum and win 2 or 3 games in Brooklyn. I don't believe in trust the process approaches. It didn't work for the Sixers and don't see the point. I am not a big believer in seeing us lose by 25+ points any time this year. I think the remaining true fans deserve better, before that number dwindles further. Your views may vary, so feel free to fire away. I'm with 23
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Post by diehardexplorer on Feb 21, 2020 14:59:37 GMT -5
We do have other players playing less that can score and create a shot who bring us better odds to avoid scoring droughts and win games. I'd rather see the experimenting with lineups end. I'd like to see Ash shortening the bench, and having experienced guys playing with confidence instead of looking over their shoulders. I'd like to see us beat remaining teams we are capable of beating, like Mass, GW, SBU and SJU. I'd like to see us take that momentum and win 2 or 3 games in Brooklyn. I don't believe in trust the process approaches. It didn't work for the Sixers and don't see the point. I am not a big believer in seeing us lose by 25+ points any time this year. I think the remaining true fans deserve better, before that number dwindles further. Your views may vary, so feel free to fire away. some people may not like this, and i don't like ripping on college players, but let's get real here. saul and shaggy are great kids, they're going to graduate in may, and they've been solid citizens their entire time here. but the minutes for these experienced players i presume you're talking about didn't start to diminish until after the loss to st louis at home which put the team at a 1-7 conference record. how long is coach ash supposed to keep doing the same thing. he's trying something different in an attempt to win games. since their minutes have been reduced, the team went 2-3, granted two of the games were against bad teams, so it's not a completely fair comparison. but how about our seniors look in the mirror and start to bring it for the remaining games. i would love for them to go out on a high note. their minutes are down because they're not performing, simple as that. instead, we're still getting dumb turnovers, poor shot selection, and bad decisions in key parts of games. you expect that from freshman, but not from guys who've been in the program for four years. here's hoping they can turn it around and stay on the floor. coach ash would love nothing more than that to happen.
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MisterD
The Baptist Himself
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Post by MisterD on Feb 21, 2020 16:00:44 GMT -5
Has anyone here ever said "its a business" in response to a kid leaving?
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Feb 22, 2020 13:22:13 GMT -5
The "playing for next year" argument gets old. If that's the case...just give away tickets to the rest of the games and say these are like scrimmages that don't really mean anything. What message does it send to the younger guys to put the seniors out to pasture? Will that happen next year to the current juniors, and the following year to the current sophomores because we'll be "playing for next year"? You'll end up with seniors constantly looking over their shoulders playing not to win....but not to make mistakes and get benched.
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Post by blueandgold on Feb 22, 2020 18:26:10 GMT -5
One game below .500 overall. For a short interlude, mate! Yes, but only because next stop was .500!
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