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Post by La Salle 08 on Sept 26, 2017 9:21:39 GMT -5
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MisterD
The Baptist Himself
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Post by MisterD on Sept 26, 2017 9:35:04 GMT -5
NCAA is going to let Penn State and Baylor mostly skate but probably drill these guys because it meant money went to some of their "amateurs".
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Post by gymrat67 on Sept 26, 2017 9:59:35 GMT -5
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Post by coqui900 on Sept 26, 2017 10:26:47 GMT -5
College sports is disgusting.
Chuck Person is on that list. That dude was a NBA player and college assistant. Why's he looking to take bribes (unless he ran up a big bill somewhere)? Not shocking that Auburn (Head Coach: Bruce Pearl) and USC are tied into this nonsense. Has Oklahoma State had any big violations for sports? I assume they have.
Side note: How the hell is Baylor allowed to have sports? You'd think "basketball head coach trying to get players to lie about a player murdering another player to cover his tracks" followed by "gross negligence in overlooking the football team's history of sexual assault" in about one decade would result in a shut down for good.
Of course, the NCAA's reaction to Penn State's overlooking of a serial child abuser resulted in some scholarship losses and the inability to go to the Capital One Bowl Game for a few years, as opposed to what should have happened -- and that's a five-year shut-down of football.
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Post by coqui900 on Sept 26, 2017 10:57:29 GMT -5
Louisville is tied into this. One of their recruits (Brian Bowen) was supposedly offered $100K to go with them even though he was looking at a bunch of other schools.
What does Rick Pitino have to do to lose his job? He certainly doesn't have to:
1) Impregnate a woman during public sex at an Italian restaurant and then paid for an abortion, bringing embarrassment to both his family and employer.
2) Having oversight over an assistant coach who paid for prostitutes and strippers in an attempt to lure recruits.
3) Program somehow entangled in a major federal criminal prosecution involving $100,000 paid to a recruit.
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Post by stlexplorer on Sept 26, 2017 11:01:01 GMT -5
This seems like the worst kept secret ever. People from an apparel company funneling players to their teams and then coming out of college with a contract with that company.
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MisterD
The Baptist Himself
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Post by MisterD on Sept 26, 2017 11:09:57 GMT -5
But think about all of the victims. Like ... ... ...
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Post by weston2 on Sept 26, 2017 11:29:33 GMT -5
This seems like the worst kept secret ever. People from an apparel company funneling players to their teams and then coming out of college with a contract with that company. Colleges are a joke. How can they teach Ethics. Do as I say, not as I do............look the other way, of course when the bucks are involved. Hardly even the tip of the iceberg. This is what you get when the Law of the Streets is observed. Then again look around you and see we don't enforce anything anymore. So who cares.
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Post by lasallerules1978 on Sept 26, 2017 13:59:24 GMT -5
NCAA is going to let Penn State and Baylor mostly skate but probably drill these guys because it meant money went to some of their "amateurs". This is outside the jurisdiction of the NCAA, this is being handled by the big dogs - FBI. People are getting arrested, if the NCAA treats this like they did the UNC case they will lose the little credibility they currently have.
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MisterD
The Baptist Himself
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Post by MisterD on Sept 26, 2017 14:28:04 GMT -5
But this is the FBI enforcing NCAA bylaws, no? Otherwise its just a finder's fee and not corruption.
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Post by durenduren on Sept 26, 2017 15:18:45 GMT -5
This means nothing for the NCAA, outside of the immediate publicity damage. It'll be water under the bridge until the sentencing, and then it'll be forgotten again -- why? Because it's "being dealt with". Because this stuff is tolerated. Hardly worthy of a footnote because nothing will happen to these programs.
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Post by calsufan on Sept 26, 2017 15:36:46 GMT -5
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Post by coqui900 on Sept 26, 2017 15:42:03 GMT -5
This is FAR from business as usual. The FBI is involved with this. I think I saw that they didn't inform the NCAA about this at all -- a sign that they have zero faith in the NCAA's abilities as investigators or as a punitive agency. And why would they? The NCAA didn't touch UNC at all. It took a newspaper article to shine the light on what was really going on there well after the NCAA closed its initial investigation.
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Post by gymrat67 on Sept 26, 2017 16:28:06 GMT -5
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Post by coqui900 on Sept 26, 2017 18:46:10 GMT -5
Pitino's denying everything. This is code for "U of L is going to have to pay me to leave or I'll sue them in court and get paid that way."
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2017 20:43:51 GMT -5
But this is the FBI enforcing NCAA bylaws, no? Otherwise its just a finder's fee and not corruption. It's not. The closest analogue is also coincidentally the brightest moment in American soccer history, and another delightful example of America doing what Europe couldn't or refused to do: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_FIFA_corruption_caseI'm also amused that this caught the NCAA entirely off guard. The good folks at the Southern District knew better than to bring Barney Fife into grownup matters. Inevitably, they're going to come in at the end like a dog on hardwood into a sliding glass door and thrash around like it's meaningful action. College sports being corrupt though, not really news to anyone open to the news. Hopefully it doesn't have point shaving's blast radius, but it's looking like it will.
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Post by coqui900 on Sept 26, 2017 21:01:45 GMT -5
This could tangentially affect us.
Miami is one of the schools involved. It looks like the player they were tangled with was Nassir Little, but there is speculation that it could be the kid from Reading.
I'm pretty sure Pitino's going to fall for this. Not sure about any of the other head coaches. It feels like assistant coaches know they have to do all the dirty work while head coaches look the other way. The only time a head coach gets involved with a recruit is when it's time to visit a player's family or the school hosts a visit. Once you become a head coach, you don't have to touch or talk about money. You only catch word if you need to sell a kid "legitimately."
I think I might be done with college sports.
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Post by blueandgold on Sept 26, 2017 21:37:53 GMT -5
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Post by durenduren on Sept 26, 2017 21:53:34 GMT -5
Pitino's scandal-related statements are interchangeable... yadda yadda I didn't know, something about upholding the highest standards, we'll fix this, I swear I didn't know, and don't forget to mention how great the U of L fans are yadda yadda...
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Post by stlexplorer on Sept 27, 2017 0:49:39 GMT -5
When is Pitino inducted in the scandal hall of fame? I mean what type of scandal has he not been involved in?
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Post by stlexplorer on Sept 27, 2017 0:53:43 GMT -5
I saw they have set up a phone number to be a tip line and are encouraging people with information related to this to call. So is every jaded coach/employee who knows they lost out on a recruit calling the hotline? I can only imagine some of the messages that are being left on that line. Godspeed to the people who have to sort through the crazies on that one.
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Post by jellybean on Sept 27, 2017 6:34:21 GMT -5
A few thoughts.
Interesting to see where the shoe guy got the money. Corporate funds?
Interesting to see if income tax evasion and possibly money laundering charges are part of the compliant. I read briefly one compliant and didn't see them.
Keep in mind the Feds have a 93% conviction rate.
I saw Sports Center and Seth Greenberg did a nice job explaining the situation.
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Sept 27, 2017 7:35:16 GMT -5
Miami is one of the schools involved. It looks like the player they were tangled with was Nassir Little, but there is speculation that it could be the kid from Reading. I think I might be done with college sports. On point #1, he 100% was bribed. On point #2, you're full of it.
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Post by stlexplorer on Sept 27, 2017 10:49:00 GMT -5
Pitino's scandal punch card officially was completed today it appears
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2017 11:32:35 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2017 11:53:40 GMT -5
Chuck Person is on that list. That dude was a NBA player and college assistant. Why's he looking to take bribes (unless he ran up a big bill somewhere)? How you get that much and still trade on these relative peanuts always blows my mind. Martha Stewart went away for the same dumb garbage. It all worked out for her in the end though:
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Post by weston2 on Sept 27, 2017 12:05:07 GMT -5
Chuck Person is on that list. That dude was a NBA player and college assistant. Why's he looking to take bribes (unless he ran up a big bill somewhere)? How you get that much and still trade on these relative peanuts always blows my mind. Martha Stewart went away for the same dumb garbage. It all worked out for her in the end though: Didn't Chucky play alongside old Sir Charles? elsewhere issues? Hmm................
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MisterD
The Baptist Himself
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Post by MisterD on Sept 27, 2017 13:11:29 GMT -5
It's not. The closest analogue is also coincidentally the brightest moment in American soccer history, and another delightful example of America doing what Europe couldn't or refused to do: But isn't it only "bribery" because payments are forbidden, not because payments from that A to that B are universally illegal? I get there might be tax implications, but those would trickle down from the initial payment being illegal. Or am I totally missing some aspect? Also, this was good.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2017 15:31:51 GMT -5
It's not. The closest analogue is also coincidentally the brightest moment in American soccer history, and another delightful example of America doing what Europe couldn't or refused to do: But isn't it only "bribery" because payments are forbidden, not because payments from that A to that B are universally illegal? I get there might be tax implications, but those would trickle down from the initial payment being illegal. Or am I totally missing some aspect? Bribery is its own separate charge, but one of the six against Chuck Person involves honest services fraud. I am not a lawyer, and my legal training consists primarily of occasionally having lunch next to Penn Law, but my understanding is that you cannot sell someone on something while also getting a kickback to push that something without disclosing your interest in doing so. The italics are key, because they almost certainly didn't disclose the payola. It is also my understanding that there was on occasion a degree of coercion. Worth noting is that they're not just accused of simple bribery. Title 18, Section 666 of the United States Code, which is what Person is being indicted under, is titled "Theft or bribery concerning programs receiving Federal funds." The relevant section: "Whoever, if the circumstance described in subsection (b) of this section existsβ being an agent of an organization, or of a State, local, or Indian tribal government, or any agency thereofβ (1)corruptly solicits or demands for the benefit of any person, or accepts or agrees to accept, anything of value from any person, intending to be influenced or rewarded in connection with any business, transaction, or series of transactions of such organization, government, or agency involving any thing of value of $5,000 or more; or (2) corruptly gives, offers, or agrees to give anything of value to any person, with intent to influence or reward an agent of an organization or of a State, local or Indian tribal government, or any agency thereof, in connection with any business, transaction, or series of transactions of such organization, government, or agency involving anything of value of $5,000 or more; shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both." That definitely applies to assistant college basketball coaches and shoe shills. Obviously all of this breaks NCAA bylaws too, but in the above you can see where it crosses into federal law. It's all there in the indictment, if you'd like to spend an evening pouring over USCs and legalese. I assume no one paid taxes on any of this either, but that's not really mentioned in anything I read. There's also some wire fraud stuff as a bonus. I think it is the latter that induced Auburn to do the following:
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Sept 27, 2017 15:36:33 GMT -5
Hmmm, that still feels to me like "keeping this secret because of NCAA bylaws" rather than "keeping this secret even if the transactions were legal". Maybe semantics at this point.
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