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Post by 23won on Mar 26, 2019 13:22:10 GMT -5
The transfer portal is not just a reflection of perceived Ash turnover but what is happening across revenue sports at D1 schools. Penn State is a fairly well established program with a coach who has been there 5+ years and who shows signs of being there 5+ years. They had four guys leave unexpectedly for the NFL and over ten players enter the portal to transfer. A lot of alums were shaking their head and worrying if this was the end of the world for the program. They also worried about depth and who could play special teams. Guess what, they are surviving and doing just fine.
There is now an established portal for players to seek what they think will be a better situation and for coaches to seek out transfer candidates. I see that as a factor here not unlike the PSU situation as opposed to Ash being heavy handed and turning over the roster exclusively. I am confident Ash is transparent and communicates expectations. I am happy we have him as a coach, am happy with who remain on the team, and I am optimistic Ash will add players to fill any roster openings in a way that makes us better than we were last year. Best wishes for all past, current and future Explorers.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Mar 26, 2019 13:26:04 GMT -5
I tend to develop a fondness for our guys. Oddly, despite how they might have performed I get a bit sad with early departures. There are a number of guys leaving here I am going to miss. Some I still had not given up the hopes of blooming. Agree with you here. They are La Salle students and I like to see as many students as possible become La Salle alums, regardless of whether they live up to their recruiting hype or not. When I hear about transfers, I see it as a loss to the La Salle community as a whole. Are they basketball players first, or La Salle students first? I guess the reality that I don't want to think about is that it's the former, and it's a business, and those are the things we don't like to think about when we wear our La Salle shirts and hang out with our alumni friends. I've witnessed new bosses coming into companies and gutting the current employees to bring in their people. I guess I just don't like to think about that happening in a school with the coach as "boss" and the players as "employees".. at least...the NCAA doesn't want us to see it that way, even if that is the reality.
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Post by vital on Mar 26, 2019 13:30:45 GMT -5
I tend to develop a fondness for our guys. Oddly, despite how they might have performed I get a bit sad with early departures. There are a number of guys leaving here I am going to miss. Some I still had not given up the hopes of blooming. Agree with you here. They are La Salle students and I like to see as many students as possible become La Salle alums, regardless of whether they live up to their recruiting hype or not. When I hear about transfers, I see it as a loss to the La Salle community as a whole. Are they basketball players first, or La Salle students first? I guess the reality that I don't want to think about is that it's the former, and it's a business, and those are the things we don't like to think about when we wear our La Salle shirts and hang out with our alumni friends. I've witnessed new bosses coming into companies and gutting the current employees to bring in their people. I guess I just don't like to think about that happening in a school with the coach as "boss" and the players as "employees".. at least...the NCAA doesn't want us to see it that way, even if that is the reality. Great point but unfortunately it's true
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Post by diehardexplorer on Mar 26, 2019 13:34:48 GMT -5
In fairness to Miles, I think there were some injuries he was battling this year. If you look at the first 9 games of the season, he scored 65% of his points, was averaging double digits in scoring, and playing significant minutes. That productivity doesn't just drop off without some injuries surfacing. In a few games I specifically remember him appearing hobbled as he ran up and down the court. Maybe his role changed when Saul came back, or maybe the injuries hurt him, but his productivity was good early on and then the numbers dropped, and in the right situation/system, he will likely get those numbers or better again. miles hurt his knee (i believe it was a sprain) when he collided with that behemoth holloway from umass in early january. he ended up missing the next three games and was never quite the same since. he then fell behind ed and jared on the depth chart. combine that with him being 2,700 miles from home, it's not surprising he's leaving. i wish he was staying but it is what it is.
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Post by diehardexplorer on Mar 26, 2019 13:38:24 GMT -5
I thought the Bucknell game was the start of something good heading towards conference play... was never able to top it. bucknell thumped us (92-79 and it wasn't anywhere near that close). not sure what game you were remembering. towson maybe?
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Mar 26, 2019 13:40:57 GMT -5
Miles had 19 and 6 in 31 minutes.
...from then on he averaged about 4 points and 3 rebounds per.
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Post by gymrat67 on Mar 26, 2019 14:02:10 GMT -5
This roster is being completely reshaped. what roster ? OK, I'll be the first one to say it. I think it should be recognized and stated here that the external optics of this " pogrom " by no means reflect entirely favorably upon either La Salle University or Ash Howard :
1. Whether accurate or not, it looks as if Ash Howard, to expedite the timetable of implementing his new order, in essence ran them off by suggesting to them that it would most probably be in their own best interests to seriously consider leaving, sooner rather than later, as there was no reasonable likelihood of their getting any meaningful playing time from now on ; and / or
2. This mass exodus strongly suggests that some if not all of these players do not care for or agree with Ash Howard's spartan coaching philosophy, system and methods and so they have voted with their feet to seek to play elsewhere for another coach with a different approach.
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Post by 1801olney on Mar 26, 2019 14:13:37 GMT -5
Transfers happen with coaching changes. There was minimal turnover last year. Only lost a de-commit (Osunniyi) and Dajour Joseph (who played 22 minutes in his career). Now its going the other way this year. It is what it is.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Mar 26, 2019 14:23:51 GMT -5
I thought the Bucknell game was the start of something good heading towards conference play... was never able to top it. bucknell thumped us (92-79 and it wasn't anywhere near that close). not sure what game you were remembering. towson maybe? No Pookie, Kimbrough, or Saul that game.
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Post by durenduren on Mar 26, 2019 14:49:18 GMT -5
OK, I'll be the first one to say it.
2. This mass exodus strongly suggests that some if not all of these players do not care for or agree with Ash Howard's spartan coaching philosophy, system and methods and so they have voted with their feet to seek to play elsewhere for another coach with a different approach.
I don't think this is the case, but for the sake of conversation... Good - He's my coach, I'm stuck with him, and if he sucks, I want him to suck with his players so there's no debate he sucks. If you don't buy in, see ya later alligator. Give me someone who does buy in until then. And if Ash still sucks in a few years, let's have that other conversation then. But he was probably just honest with them - you aren't going to play here, so here's your chance to do it on your terms.
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Mar 26, 2019 14:57:33 GMT -5
There is a third option: They realized that the current freshmen and incoming freshmen were going to get the lion share of the minutes and that was enough to have them see the writing is on the wall.
Some of them weren't good enough. And that is ok.
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Mar 26, 2019 15:00:32 GMT -5
Given the normal transfer rate, thinking there won't be a spike when a new coach with a new system comes in is weird. Its not a reflection on anyone.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Mar 26, 2019 15:05:04 GMT -5
OK, I'll be the first one to say it. I think it should be recognized and stated here that the external optics of this " pogrom " by no means reflect entirely favorably upon either La Salle University or Ash Howard :
1. Whether accurate or not, it looks as if Ash Howard, to expedite the timetable of implementing his new order, in essence ran them off by suggesting to them that it would most probably be in their own best interests to seriously consider leaving, sooner rather than later, as there was no reasonable likelihood of their getting any meaningful playing time from now on ; and / or
2. This mass exodus strongly suggests that some if not all of these players do not care for or agree with Ash Howard's spartan coaching philosophy, system and methods and so they have voted with their feet to seek to play elsewhere for another coach with a different approach.
About 5 minutes before you posted this, I texted to a friend: "I hope this isn't a situation where a rookie coach is blaming the players for his inability to coach them up and adjust to their abilities from what he had at Nova. I guess we'll see what he does with 'his' guys in a few years."
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Post by durenduren on Mar 26, 2019 15:07:21 GMT -5
Given the normal transfer rate, thinking there won't be a spike when a new coach with a new system comes in is weird. Its not a reflection on anyone. It might be reflective of Dolphin's bad predictions. The players couldn't understand why we didn't go 30-0.
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Post by explorer88 on Mar 26, 2019 15:13:34 GMT -5
My goodness, who cares what the optics are? I want a winning basketball program. I don't want a bunch of criminals or drop outs but no one should be complaining that a new coach wants his own players and players that can win. After all, why would you keep players you don't think can win with and could get you fired?
Everyone wanted this coach. Let him do what he thinks is best for the program. That is why he was brought in. After a certain time he will be judged on the results but he should have the control on how the outcome plays out. Not someone else.
Kudos to Ash for making tough choices. I am sure it isn't easy telling kids they won't play for you like they may have played in the past but it is tough to win in college basketball. Have to do what you think is necessary to succeed.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Mar 26, 2019 15:26:14 GMT -5
My goodness, who cares what the optics are? After a certain time he will be judged on the results Recruits care about these optics...as do their parents who send them to play for him. What is the "certain time"? 2 years, 3, 4 ?
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Post by theneumann64 on Mar 26, 2019 15:26:52 GMT -5
All 3 Sophomores leaving was entirely in the realm of possibility (I'll argue Sullivan and Moultrie were basically certainties, based solely on playing time) and Brookins I figured was probably 50/50 (again, with no inside knowledge of anything, just observing the rotation, not a reflection on any of the kids).
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Post by explorer88 on Mar 26, 2019 15:29:30 GMT -5
My goodness, who cares what the optics are? After a certain time he will be judged on the results Recruits care about these optics...as do their parents who send them to play for him. What is the "certain time"? 2 years, 3, 4 ? That is a load of bull. I can see if Ash was running off players he recruited. These are not his players. If you worry about that you are a dead man walking. You have to do what you think is needed to succeed.
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Mar 26, 2019 15:33:06 GMT -5
So much projecting here. Didn't Howard prove, by losing zero roster players and only one commit, that he's not the type to run anyone off? These kinds of things can be amicable and we have no indication at all these aren't.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Mar 26, 2019 15:33:44 GMT -5
Recruits care about these optics...as do their parents who send them to play for him. What is the "certain time"? 2 years, 3, 4 ? That is a load of bull. I can see if Ash was running off players he recruited. These are not his players. If you worry about that you are a dead man walking. You have to do what you think is needed to succeed. If I were recruiting against him, I would say to a parent, "Are you sure you want to go play for him? He doesn't seem to retain players, and if he leaves, it appears the school just encourages the kids to leave if they replace the coach. Don't you want your child to come play for me and our University and know he will graduate?" Whether true or not, a coach from another school could say that, and there's no way to refute it right now.
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Post by durenduren on Mar 26, 2019 15:35:10 GMT -5
We'd naturally assume Ash kicked each player in the nuts as they walked out of his office because hugging Cian is too awkward to conceptualize. Amicable, shamicable.
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Mar 26, 2019 15:35:56 GMT -5
I'd create a fake twitter post where he talks shit on each one but I don't trust half this board and all of St. Joseph's of PA not to run with it.
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Post by GlitterBro #2 on Mar 26, 2019 15:38:56 GMT -5
I'd create a fake twitter post where he talks shit on each one but I don't trust half this board and all of St. Joseph's of PA not to run with it. You would owe royalties to Bryan Colangelo for that...
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Post by explorer88 on Mar 26, 2019 15:39:49 GMT -5
That is a load of bull. I can see if Ash was running off players he recruited. These are not his players. If you worry about that you are a dead man walking. You have to do what you think is needed to succeed. If I were recruiting against him, I would say to a parent, "Are you sure you want to go play for him? He doesn't seem to retain players, and if he leaves, it appears the school just encourages the kids to leave if they replace the coach. Don't you want your child to come play for me and our University and know he will graduate?" Whether true or not, a coach from another school could say that, and there's no way to refute it right now. I think you are reaching and assuming such a negative impact for something that is common with new coaches. Seems not to affect a lot of other coaches that were hired and the previous coaches players left. But hey, to each their own.
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MisterD
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Post by MisterD on Mar 26, 2019 15:40:49 GMT -5
"If Quinerly transfers from Villanova after extremely limited PT this season, why would any 5 star consider committing ..."
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Post by durenduren on Mar 26, 2019 15:46:23 GMT -5
I'd create a fake twitter post where he talks shit on each one but I don't trust half this board and all of St. Joseph's of PA not to run with it. So you haven't found my 'Dr Giannini's Paninis' twitter account where a shabbily dressed man with salt & pepper hair reviews and occasionally yells at various paninis ?
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Post by JoeFedorowicz on Mar 26, 2019 16:46:11 GMT -5
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Post by lasalle69bestever on Mar 26, 2019 17:46:19 GMT -5
Just a quick reminder : Although it's getting very tiring and requires substantial continuing effort, I still feel compelled to "like" every post by Gnocchi and durenduren regardless of content due to the tremendously high quality of their avatars.
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nvrlst
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Post by nvrlst on Mar 26, 2019 20:21:22 GMT -5
The only wrong move would be taking reach freshmen to fill out next year's roster. If we need a second bridge year to make sure we aren't just grabbing future transfers or 10th men, so be it. We could bring back the 2 walk-ons he cut I have a year of eligibility left - think Ash needs a 50 something forward with bad knees?
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Post by durenduren on Mar 26, 2019 20:40:31 GMT -5
WHY DIDNT YOU DELETE THE NOT FUNNY POST SINCE YOU DELETE EVERYTHING ELSE, JOE?!
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